NcStar

[Azzy]

So i took the chance and spent a bit of cash on some NcStar products. And what I can tell you all it.... DON'T.

So far, I picked up a 91/30 rear sight mount and scope combo. The aluminum used could only be described best (to paraphrase Doc Nickel) "Velveeta grade". When the aluminum wasn't stripping... the bolt heads would snap off. And this isn't with some gorilla wrenching on these things, I'm trying only to make them "2 finger tight". I know what it takes to strip out a screw hole in aluminum (after fixing a few paintball guns and rebuilding a Honda CB650), and their stuff takes the cake.

Next I picked up one of their composite laser units for a pistol. Interesting device... if it didn't flex wildly because of a single screw clamping action (which I found to be pulling the nut out of the hole.... its only a friction fit). There is no way I could see this thing ever holding anything close to a zero, not even for average plinking. I wouldn't use this on an airsoft gun if I had one.

At least I think I can return the laser, lets see if CDNN will take it back. The combo I picked up off of ebay, and guess that is just $90 down the tubes.

(Oh, and I have seen a few people selling this stuff at gun shows, and for a huge markup. Worst price on that laser oline was $39... one I saw at the Washington show was $89 )

[riverpirate]

ive seen their stuff at gunshows and have always wondered about it. i figured it was for airsoft stuff only because the stuff i looked at was cheap feeling. the ncstar stuff on ebay is usually list for airsoft guns only firgured it wouldnt hold up to regular rifles and such.

[Azzy]

To be fair, this is what I got back from them-

Hi this is Rich from the Tech Support Dept.

You may send the items (mount, scope, laser) in for Warranty and we will replace all of them free of charge. I will waive the handling fee requirement for you.

The laser unit sounds like one of our #ATPRLS units, sounds like you may have had our original revision 1.0 units. We have since done many improvements to the laser. We have done 8 new product changes/improvements and are currently on Revision 2.0 of the #ATPRLS.

I’ve included our Warranty form. Just send the completed form with your items and we will replace all three items with brand new factory replacements.


There were a few problems with the ATPRLS Rev 1.0. The original rail clamp had a brass knurled nut that was molded into it, the brass nut would pull through the plastic if over tightened. So, we had our factory Engineers redesign the rail clamp. The ATPRLS Rev 1.5 had the new style rail clamp, which resolved the threaded nut from being pulled through the plastic. It now has a black hex nut that is secured and molded into the side of the rail clamp. Making it nearly impossible to pull the threaded nut through the rail, which was our biggest complaint.

The plastic used in the rev 1.0 & rev 1.5 main body was on the brittle side, but it has since been changed for a more durable material since the initial release (in Rev 2.0).

With feedback from our customers and Dealers we went onto to make further improvements to the ATPRL, which resulted in 6 more design improvements. We are currently at Revision 2.0 of the ATPRLS. We sold the first production runs of the ATPRLS 2.0 at the end of July 2009.

Some of the improvements to revision 2.0 from revision 1.0 are:
1. Rail clamp redesigned with larger threaded nut.
2. Larger laser diode body – helps with holding zero from big bore cartridges.
3. Larger and deeper pocket in the laser body for the larger laser diode – helps with holding zero from big bore cartridges.
4. Plastic was reformulated to make it more pliable – increased durability.
5. On/Off switch redesigned, made thicker and stronger.
6. Circuit board redesigned, for better internal routing.
7. Wires soldered to laser diode are much shorter and a have a more direct routing to the new circuit board. – increased durability & reliability.

Version 2.0 of the ATPRLS was extensively torture tested at our local SOCAL ranges on various types of firearms. Tested on various calibers of: handguns, rifles, and shotguns. The ATPRLS passed all tests with flying colors.

The problems that were experienced/reported were with the revision 1.0 of the ATPRLS. With the feedback we received we were able to make a much better product. The current production run of the ATPRLS 2.0 is a great success now and our customers are now very happy with them.

[Guns & Glass]

Sending a brand new 30mm illuminated Tactical back to Rich for a repair-replacement for a friend/customer. On a Rem 700 DBL which isn't a lot of recoil, yet I can move the Fast Focus Eyepiece up/down w/enough pressure, and I can feel the slop in the turrent adjustment.

BUTT they're cheap, and for those people who don't want to learn what good optics are, or just can't wait and save up for quality products like that, they fill the need for immediate gratification.

Quite a few times while range testing equipment or just punching holes guys come over for help after 'itchbing' about poor groups or untrackable adjustments. I'll take a quick look at the scope & mounts, and now just them them outright, "Sorry, you bought low quality gear, and there's nothing I can do to help".

Selling & improving after complaints is par for many importers/companies like Nc Star, Bec, Leapers, even Osprey. Just goes to show their commitment in spending time & money to do R&D, test, and impliment good QC measures.

[Azzy]

Tue. I would venture however, that some people's version of cheap glass isnt all that cheap. You start to wonder when that extra $200 really is going to kick in, or at what point does it make a difference past a name.

Ive got a no name 4 x 24 scope on a 22 rifle that can put ragged holes in a sheet of paper, no problem. Got it in a box of miscellaneous gear. Granted, its not much recoil on that, but after a couple hundred rounds, I haven't seen an issue.

[tdyoung58]

I was stupid and bought a spotting scope with the NcStar label. I gave it away after I bought a Leupold to replace it.

Cheap optics aren't so cheap once you have to replace them.

[Azzy]

What was the problem with it?

[jcabin]

To think I almost threw one of those NCstar scopes on my M38..

[Guns & Glass]

Buyers Beware!
Makers know most scopes are sold in the showroom, or at some show. Some use coatings favoring indoor lighting their low price models look very good compared those at medium-high price points.

Some skew their sale pitches & sales literature to sound & look good.

Remember they want to sell, sell, sell so they can afford the better things in life. Bet if they were taking costly hunts, competing in shooting competitions, or going real life tactical....they wouldn't use what they sell.

Recently a world wide hunter, and his buddy (a benchrester) stopped to visit. The hunter uses mostly Austrian-German scopes (even on his muzzle loader) to do some nighttime comparing of other makers. After setting all scopes exactly alike they went outside in the dark surrounded by snow and cold.

After what seemed like an eternity (I was getting cold thinking about them) they walked in literally in "shock & awe" at the differences. Discussion then moved onto design & construction.

Hunter figures the costs of the seeing best in low light & the more rugged optical tools vs. hunt costs & lifetime enjoyment as extra protection & insurance.
Bench rester wants the best so he can see & have the best tracking adjustments which for him...simply eliminates the variables.

Different applications, but smart.....investments!

A brief list of some construction cost adders:
Type of aluminum,
Tube thickness,
Tube construction,
Tube length/recessed lens,
Erector lens tube material,
Zoom tube material,
Zoom tube cam pin design, material,
Zoom cam pin bearing cap material,
O ring material & type,
Thread pitch. Actually pitches since different sizes are needed for different components,
Manufacturing tolerances,
Optical tolerences fit up,
Assembly tolerences,
Turrent internal adjustment materials,
Bias (leaf) spring material,
Coil spring material,
# of springs used.

When addressing the optical design, components, materials, & fitting the list can be just as long...but 2-3 times more expensive.

Good glass is a worthwile investment and worth waiting for.

Great glass is a lifetime investment in pleasure.

"When the head rules the eye see better"

[rovert97]

while i generally agree that NCStar is crap, ive had one optic from them that ive great luck with. i have the 3-9x42 MarkIII illuminated scope. picked it up for $69 or so. granted its intended use was for a .22 rifle. i do believe that it could withstand a .223 AR. the optics are fine but no where near that of a $400 scope. but it does its job well out to 50 yards.



i wont however buy anything else they make.