Gotta get it out to use it

[mercop]

Any monkey with a knife in his hand will likely be able to cut one or two attackers off of him with little effort.

The problem is when and how to get the knife out. Deployment is the key in using any tool for self-defense. Everyone sees himself or herself as a good guy; even bad guys think they are the good guys. Two scenarios-

I think we all assume everyone is armed, even if we cannot see a weapon. So three guys with no visible weapon approach you, you know it is a robbery. At what point do you draw your knife? Before you they are close? What if they pull a gun in response? At this distance the gun wins. Often criminals will not display a weapon if they can avoid it, why take an armed robbery charge why you don't need to.

Scenario 2- they are either closing in on you or have already made physical contact. Where is your knife? Have you trained to create the space needed to deploy it from the bottom of a dog pile? If your arm is pinned extended against you body or held closed have you trained for that? Do you have a tool on your reaction side as well?

Since MCS concentrates on open hand, stick, knife, and gun within seven yards these types of situations come up in force on force drills all the time.

People talk about so and so being good with a knife. Good with a knife once it is in their hand. The majority of people who kill and injure with edged weapons have no formal training. What they have is the element of offensive surprise and force of violence.

It would make as much sense to say that someone who is good at shoot a pistol is good at defending against a pistol.

We get people from all kinds of backgrounds from novices to masters and gurus. All that stylized stuff goes out the window once you get punched in the face or your head is slammed against the wall.

You are about 100 times more likely to have to defend against an edged weapon you won't see than use an edged weapon of your own to defend yourself. This truth does not fill dojos that are why it is all but ignored.

Our two-day Edged Weapon Course is as follow-
Day I- Spontaneous Attack Survival against Edged Weapons- this is our open hand combatives course. We train against the weapons you can't see instead of just teaching open hand combatives. When you train against edged weapons there is no room for error, this makes your skill set more reliable.

Day 2- Inverted Edge Tactics, this is our answer to the OP's question. The idea of the course is to teach you how to deploy any blade from under a dog pile by using yours and your attackers anatomy to cut your way up and out. We teach to fight like a cat, which fights to get away. Instead of a dog who fights to win.

As far as the posters who always pipe in here about not bringing a knife to a gunfight. We teach that to0. People without training also fail miserably when trying to get their gun out after or during physical contact. During force on force wearing headgear and using airsoft we have found that once you get rocked in face you loose your concentration in reference to getting your gun out.

What is more likely that a punch in the face? How about falling backward and smacking your head. Have you practiced drawing your pistol from the ground? How about retaining it when your jacket flies back and the bad guy sees it and thinking he is the good guy goes for it?

This is not a game with rules. It is chaos without rules. If you train with rules chance are you will not fair well, especially if you make up the rules. - George

[Shawn.L]

I was recently thinking about this very topic in regards to presentations.

Wether it be presenting a blade, or a pistol.

What I have seen a few times is when something goes wrong, people pause and want to know what. They look down, they investigate.

you see this on the range with shooters all the time. The gun jams, they stop, they look at it. Sometimes their buddies come over and have a peek, now you have a council around the gun when the trained response should be TAP-RACK, strong, hard and fast.

I tell myself to tear through it.

Pistol caught up in cover garment? KEEP MOVING

getting the knife from a pocket can be even harder, its smaller to grab, and its inside (I carry OWB, normally with an open front cover garment).

After my last class with MCS I got together with some of the attendees for a practice day. I learned fast that the particualy pants I wore that day where inhibbiting my getting the knife out....... tight pockets.

One good thing about a knife is the ability to "pre-load" it. If you feel you need to you can easily palm it and be at the ready with half your presentation done.

I was at the bank the other week.
A guy came in, looked rough, dirty, he was mumbling. Pacing back and forth, in and out of line.
I thought "here we go"
I didnt suspect a robbery, he seemed deranged, I suspected he may attack someone.
He didnt seem to have any weapons.
I had my blade in my hand palmed and ready before the security guard even noticed him.
Security got him sitting and squared away before I left.

[LittleRedToyota]

What is more likely that a punch in the face? How about falling backward and smacking your head. Have you practiced drawing your pistol from the ground? How about retaining it when your jacket flies back and the bad guy sees it and thinking he is the good guy goes for it?

for that matter, have you (not "you", george) practiced not smacking your head when you fall backward?

it's actually a critical skill...and one very few people ever learn or practice. (btw, tuck your chin tight against your chest and hold it there hard.)

lying on your back in a fight can be a very shitty place to be...but it's much less shitty if you can at least still see straight and know where you are.

[Shawn.L]

for that matter, have you (not "you", george) practiced not smacking your head when you fall backward?

it's actually a critical skill...and one very few people ever learn or practice.

lying on your back in a fight can be a very shitty place to be...but it's much less shitty if you can at least still see straight and know where you are.

suprisingly, yes. And I found out just how effective that was during the ice last sunday........
I went down HARD, both feet kicked out on a slanted walk with my hands full of rifles and coffee.
another good reminder about not carrying SOB, as I would have gotten greivous injury.

[LittleRedToyota]

And I found out just how effective that was during the ice last sunday........

indeed. it is amazingly effective. you can hit the ground **hard**, but if you absorb the fall with your entire back and keep your chin tucked, it often doesn't even really hurt.

I went down HARD, both feet kicked out on a slanted walk with my hands full of rifles and coffee.

glad to hear you are OK. this is the type of fall where many people smack their heads and get a concussion or worse. i actually saw a (young, college) guy die as a result of falling over backward and smacking his head on the ground while playing softball. if he had tucked his chin, he would have probably popped right back up. sad.

[Kaos]

for that matter, have you (not "you", george) practiced not smacking your head when you fall backward?

it's actually a critical skill...and one very few people ever learn or practice. (btw, tuck your chin tight against your chest and hold it there hard.)

lying on your back in a fight can be a very shitty place to be...but it's much less shitty if you can at least still see straight and know where you are.

I used to skateboard so this comes naturally to me. I'd like to learn some FoF this coming year.

[Hawk]

for that matter, have you (not "you", george) practiced not smacking your head when you fall backward?

it's actually a critical skill...and one very few people ever learn or practice. (btw, tuck your chin tight against your chest and hold it there hard.)

lying on your back in a fight can be a very shitty place to be...but it's much less shitty if you can at least still see straight and know where you are.

Good point. As a student in the grappling arts you are taught that the ground can hit you opponent much harder than your hand or foot could.

Boy, I hope I NEVER need to defend myself against a knife attack without a firearm. Regardless of how much training you have you are bound to get cut up if you have to try to defend yourself (without a gun) against a bad guy with a knife. I'd rather defend against a baseball bat! Anyways, knowing what area's of your body to protect, and what area's of your body that you can sacrifice is important. Knowing the difference a stab or a slash has on ones anatomy and which induces more shock should be investigated. IMHO, if I had to defend myself against a knife attack (one guy), he would definitely get a few hits in before I took both his eyes and crushed his windpipe. If I couldn't run away!!!!