Future Direction of PAFOA as an Association & the Past Lack of Such Guidance

[ScaredOnce]

I broached this topic in another thread (the one about the removal of "neg-repping"), but I hope it's worth further more focused discourse. I truly hope others care as I have really started to care about the mission and purpose of our group. I love jacking around and having livid conversations online, but I think we were meant for more than that.

PAFOA has a lot of potential as evidenced by the dedication and interest of its members. What can we do to further that cause? Beyond just treating PAFOA as an internet forum where we can jabber on about firearms and have discussions with like-minded people... What is our next step?

The forum has shown that there are many with interest and desire to work for our presumed goals. Is that being taken advantage of and capitalized upon? If not, how do we do it better?

It takes leadership, but it also takes our voice and support. Do we have what it takes to support such an ambition, or is PAFOA just another chat room website on the internet?

I have seen this "Dan's server, Dan's rules" comment before, repeatedly.

That statement wonderfully demonstrates one of the underlying problems, that led to this very discussion. That this website/internet-forum, despite the name, is no association!

[DISCLAIMER]Please note that in the following, I in NO WAY intent to question if or how much any staff member or Daniel in particular cares about PAFOA as a whole. It is a subjective discussion about the organizational aspects of PAFOA.[/DISCLAIMER]

If PAFOA were actually an association, with Daniel as its elected/appointed President or not, he would not view himself as site owner, making rules. He would feel as if he would be the registrant for the domain name only as representative of the association. As a steward. He and every other staff member would look at the domain and the server as community/association resources, funded by donations or membership fees. This apparently is not the case (please correct me if I'm wrong, I am not trying to attack anyone here but want to get clarification as to how this "organization" is actually structured). As it looks like from all the comments made by the staff and other members, who's opinions I highly value, Daniel is the self appointed President and Ruler of the association by power of ownership of the domain and server resources.

I'd like to see this discussed in detail with the intended outcome that PAFOA become a stronger, directed membership and be truly an "association".

If there is no interest in that endeavor, then I'll still stick around and just treat this like a cheap chat-room focused on a topic that interests me.

I thought that this thread wasn't the place for this discussion. Maybe it is... I'd like to better understand what my participation in PAFOA means towards a membership in an association (pafoA, right?). I'd like to see regional meetings of members with some structure that affects the whole group. If the only purpose of this forum is self-creating and offers little more than a chat space, then it will go by the wayside sooner than later.

Sure, as of right now we do a lot of good with the little tools that we have. We've donated funds and offered them to those in need. We've offered and exchanged knowledge, etc. But, is that all PAFOA is meant to be? If so, let us know. Then, we can spend more time elsewhere. I think we've spent too much time on the IT-guys' opinions about how to have a successful server than any consideration about maintaining a true association.

If not, set the intentions and visions into an agreed upon statement of mission and goals that includes all of the stakeholders. (this is association 101, btw) Gain the buy-in and collective support, or at least engagement, of those parties here who care. Give them jobs to do. I'm not talking about social moderation of the forum, either. That's the lowest job on the totem pole (I'm sure some mods would agree). Positions of responsibility should be created with jobs to further our collective goals. Otherwise, PAFOA will be the biggest wasted potential for pro-2A causes I've ever seen.

We are so close to being "for real". However, more people die on the mountain the closer they come to reaching the summit. Ask George Mallory... Either way, this mountain "is there".



My disclaimer: I believe what I typed.

I'm proud and continually surprised by the caliber and decency of those I meet here. I'm sure that we're destined for more than what we currently are... Though what we are now is a great step in the right direction. I'm sure we're all thankful to those that dedicate time, money and concern to this site and its causes. Whether that's mods, Dan or Doug, frequent posters or that guy that shows up once a year and leaves a jewel of wisdom...

It takes leadership, but it also takes our voice and support. I'd like to see a leader of PAFOA speak to congresspersons and say that have the backing and support and 25,000 members and it actually be true. Not that there are a few thousand members who participate in an online forum and agree by complicity with moderators who police their posts. Do we have what it takes to support such an ambition, or is PAFOA just another chat room website on the internet?


What do you want PAFOA to be as an association and what can you do or recommend to help in that desired undertaking?




Also, for those that have access to the PAFOA Club section, I pose a further inquiry... http://forum.pafoa.org/pafoa-club-13...forms-etc.html

[jcabin]

When Dan declared during a testimony to our congressmen just a few weeks ago, that he was the president of an association of 25,000 members, whom he was representing that day, I thought where was the association? Not that I disagree with what he did there that day, but perhaps it is time to bring to light what it is we really are.

We have no say in what happens here, we have no elected representatives from within.

I can't believe it's easy for Dan to be running the show all by himself at this point. If we have 25,000 members we need to break this thing out into a local, to regional, to state level participation. We could double the number in the next two to three years, and thats being conservative. We need to become a recognizable association that can truly speak for it's members, because the members are there to participate and make decisions. We have the potential to become everything the NRA gave up. We can become a powerful player in protecting our second amendment rights. At the same time spreading the idea of liberty and self reliance, and responsibility.

[Carnes]

Our roots:

http://forum.pafoa.org/forum-announc...oa-forums.html

danp
March 22nd, 2006
Founder & President

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location:
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
(Philadelphia County)
Age: 27
Posts: 3,183
Rep Power: 10

Welcome!

My name is Dan and I am the administrator of this website and forum so here's a little information about me.

I'm currently 24 and living in Philadelphia. I did not grow up around guns and actually the first time I ever handled a gun was in 2004. Needless to say I have since handled and bought many.

One of the things I remember from when I decided to pick up firearms as a hobby was the complete lack of information related to shooting in Philadelphia, or even the state of Pennsylvania as a whole. There were no websites that did a good job of listing shooting ranges or telling you good dealers to work with.

The goal of this site is to simply fill that void. I am hoping that by organizing shooters from all over the state in one place everyone can learn new things, organize events, meet new people and hopefully make some new friends.

The main feature of this website is obviously the discussion areas where anyone can post pretty much anything they want. I really have no intention of filtering any of the content on these forums short of illegal content and severely hateful content that serves absolutely no purpose.

One other major feature that I really hope people will use is the Calendar. If you look at the top Navigation bar you'll see a link to the Calendar. Once you view the calendar you can look at all of the upcoming events that have been added. As currently configured anyone can submit a new event for the calendar and put into the queue for approval. If you know of anything going on in the state such as Gun Shows, Promotional days at a dealer, shooting events such as IDPA please don't hesitate to submit it as an event! Another great feature about the calendar is that on the main page of the forum at the bottom you can see all events that are coming up in the next 30 days.

To a lesser extent I hope that this forum may be used to organize PA gun owners involved in the political process and interacting with our elected representatives at the state and national level in influencing law and policy.

I really hope this website turns out to be a helpful resource for everyon involved and do not hesitate to contact me with any questions or concerns.

Good luck and happy shooting,
Dan P, Administrator PAFOA.ORG
Last edited by danp; December 1st, 2007 at 04:22 PM.

This is what got us to where we are today. People should think long and hard before pissing around with that.

[jcabin]

Our roots:

This is what got us to where we are today. People should think long and hard before pissing around with that.

I think that decentralized as it is, we have the potential to appeal to fellow citizens and our congressmen on a grander platform.

I'm for decentralization, I'm also for taking an auspicious anomoly and turning it into something this state and this country needs.

[King 5.45]

If this is still here tomorrow (or, for that matter, if any of us are, as well) I'll type something out tomorrow.

[ScaredOnce]

I think that decentralized as it is, we have the potential to appeal to fellow citizens and our congressmen on a grander platform.

ARE WE ORGANIZED ENOUGH TO LEVERAGE THAT POTENTIAL AT ALL??

No.

This isn't meant to pu-pu anything. This is with a motivated spirit... Change is good. Let's shake things up a bit and leverage our potential. I think we actually do have faith in our leadership, to an extent. Let's help that leadership grow and evolve into something that can effect our goals accurately.



Maybe we should define those goals in more explicit detail...?

[unloved]

Maybe we should define those goals in more explicit detail...?

Fuck "maybe we should", we need to define goals if we're going to have any hope of doing anything worthwhile.

[Swarner793]

If this is still here tomorrow (or, for that matter, if any of us are, as well) I'll type something out tomorrow.

You mean Spotter was right?

Be safe (and is this the shitstorm?).

Scott

[ScaredOnce]

If this is still here tomorrow (or, for that matter, if any of us are, as well) I'll type something out tomorrow.

Do you really think that if we're respectful and have a good discussion here that anyone would want to quash the popular voice? That'd blow my mind on PAFOA... especially considering what we're here to supposedly fight for.

So, good point. PLEASE KEEP THIS OBJECTIVE AND RESPECTFUL. Mods, do you job to make sure this happens. Thanks.

If the leadership doesn't want their constituents to have voices with equity, do you really want to be counted amongst that membership? Sounds kinda like old Pat Henry's quote, eh?

[jcabin]

ARE WE ORGANIZED ENOUGH TO LEVERAGE THAT POTENTIAL AT ALL??

No.

This isn't meant to pu-pu anything. This is with a motivated spirit... Change is good. Let's shake things up a bit and leverage our potential. I think we actually do have faith in our leadership, to an extent. Let's help that leadership grow and evolve into something that can effect our goals accurately.



Maybe we should define those goals in more explicit detail...?

No, we don't have that leverage right now. I understand how originally it was meant to be decentralized, and to get people out there. Well, that dream has been realized, many of "us" got out there. Now we have a 25,000 citizen "membership". Let's unite under the same flag, become something recognizable. Before I get any further into that, we need to define what our goals will be. Once that is accomplished we can go about a way to achieve those goals.