Is a loaded magazine considered a loaded weapon?

[WishIWasFlying]

Is a loaded magazine considered a loaded weapon?

I ask this because something I read on one of these threads made me question one of my practices. As a CC'er with LTCF, I want to be a safe, lawful, and responsible gun owner.

I keep a spare magazine in the door of my car. It is loaded with FMJ instead of the defensive HP's I load in my carry firearm. I intentionally choose FMJ in the event that I may one day wind up in NJ. If I ever did go over to the wrong side of the river, I could (not by choice) leave my defensive side arm at home and not worry about having to remove the magazine from the car.

But something I read here recently made me rethink that practice. That it may not even be safe to have a loaded magazine in the passenger compartment of the car - even with no firearm.

What is the legal treatment of a loaded magazine? Is it considered a weapon or loaded firearm? Do our neighbor states (NJ, DE, NY) have differing treatments?

[gnbrotz]

In PA, a loaded magazine is not considered a "weapon" and not regulated or licensed in any way.

*One minor exception to this is that when you check a firearm at a courthouse it is very unlikely that you will be permitted to maintain possession of your loaded magazine, but as far as having it on your person, or in your vehicle, you have no worries.

You should check the NRA site or other state firearm forums to get the best info about other state laws.

[unloved]

What is the legal treatment of a loaded magazine? Is it considered a weapon or loaded firearm?

Not in Pennsylvania.

Do our neighbor states (NJ, DE, NY) have differing treatments?

I don't know, but I wouldn't be surprised if NJ and/or NY consider a loaded magazine to be a weapon.

[fingers80002]

Is a loaded magazine considered a loaded weapon?

I ask this because something I read on one of these threads made me question one of my practices. As a CC'er with LTCF, I want to be a safe, lawful, and responsible gun owner.

I keep a spare magazine in the door of my car. It is loaded with FMJ instead of the defensive HP's I load in my carry firearm. I intentionally choose FMJ in the event that I may one day wind up in NJ. If I ever did go over to the wrong side of the river, I could (not by choice) leave my defensive side arm at home and not worry about having to remove the magazine from the car.

But something I read here recently made me rethink that practice. That it may not even be safe to have a loaded magazine in the passenger compartment of the car - even with no firearm.

What is the legal treatment of a loaded magazine? Is it considered a weapon or loaded firearm? Do our neighbor states (NJ, DE, NY) have differing treatments?

You are taking a HUGE risk taking anything into PRNJ........

[cgbudde]

You are taking a HUGE risk taking anything into PRNJ........

Including ones self.

[Pa. Patriot]

In PA, a loaded magazine is not considered a "weapon" and not regulated or licensed in any way.

*One minor exception to this is that when you check a firearm at a courthouse it is very unlikely that you will be permitted to maintain possession of your loaded magazine, but as far as having it on your person, or in your vehicle, you have no worries.

You should check the NRA site or other state firearm forums to get the best info about other state laws.

^ What my twin brother said.

[D.Hamilton]

Well this is a topic of considerable conversations here in MD and on the MDShooters forum.

Basically it has boiled down to this. Some POs will claim and have harassed some with loaded mags, but there have not been any reports of someone arrested for having a loaded magazine, if it is stored apart from the firearm. Having both laying on the back seat is not "separation".

There has even been an e-mail and letter posted, from the Assistant AG (Bowen) stating that a loaded magazine is not a "loaded weapon".

I am not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice. However, as I have before, I post below the complete text of an e-mail that was sent to another gun owner about five years ago by Mark Bowen, who was then and is a Maryland Assistant Attorney General who specializes in firearms issues. Mr. Bowen provided a succinct summary of the requirements of the state and federal laws that govern the transportation of handguns in Maryland.

***

Dear Mr. _______:

Maryland law generally prohibits the wearing, carrying or transporting of handgun, loaded or unloaded, concealed or openly: 1) on or about one's person; and, 2) in a vehicle traveling on a road or parking lot generally used by the public, highway, waterway, or airway of the State.
Individuals who have been issued a permit to carry a handgun by the Maryland Department of State Police (handgun carry permits issued by other states are not effective) are exempted from this law.

The following activities are also exempted: 1) the carrying of a handgun on the person or in a vehicle while the person is transporting the handgun to or from the place of legal purchase or sale, or to or from a bona fide repair shop, or between bona fide residences of the person, or between the bona fide residence and place of business of the person, if the business is operated and owned substantially by the person if each handgun is unloaded and carried in an enclosed case or an enclosed holster; 2) the wearing, carrying, or transporting by a person of a handgun used in connection with an organized military activity, a target shoot, formal or informal target practice, sport shooting event, hunting, a Department of Natural Resources-sponsored firearms and hunter safety class, trapping, or a dog obedience training class or show, while the person is engaged in, on the way to, or returning from that activity if each handgun is unloaded and carried in an enclosed case or an enclosed holster; 3) the moving by a bona fide gun collector of part or all of the collector's gun collection from place to place for public or private exhibition if each handgun is unloaded and carried in an enclosed case or an enclosed holster; 4) the wearing, carrying, or transporting of a handgun by a person on real estate that the person owns or leases or where the person resides or within the confines of a business establishment that the person owns or leases; 5) the wearing, carrying, or transporting of a handgun by a supervisory employee: in the course of employment; within the confines of the business establishment in which the supervisory employee is employed; and (iii) when so authorized by the owner or manager of the business establishment.

The federal law you cite (18 USC 926A) applies to the interstate transportation of a firearm (handgun or long arm) and supersedes Maryland law. It would have no bearing on the transportation of a firearm where the origin and destination are both within Maryland. It would however allow for the transportation of a firearm through the State of Maryland regardless of the Maryland law cited above.

For purposes of the exceptions to Maryland law, a handgun may be transported within the passenger compartment of the vehicle provided it is unloaded and in an enclosed case or holster. For purposes of the federal law exception, the firearm must be unloaded and not readily accessible from the passenger compartment.

Mark H. Bowen Assistant Attorney General

(end of quotation from Mr. Bowen)

[tl_3237]

I have never read of a loaded magazine being considered a weapon IN THE ABSENCE OF A FIREARM; even in NJ.

There are various state definitions of what constitutes a LOADED firearm but all of those presume a firearm's opresence to begin with.

Note that although your magazine sans firearm is not considered a loaded firearm, you may potentially have other issues in some states where 'large capacity' magazines are controlled (15 rds in NJ unless for registered assault weapon used in DCM competition).

[knight0334]

There are some states that you cannot have ammo in the magazine, even if the magazine not in the gun while in a vehicle. It constitutes a "loaded gun" in such places. In such states that having licensing or honor other state's licenses, that rule of law is exempted for honored licensees.

However, with NJ and NY, you're fucked just having the gun in either of those states if you're not transporting under the entire rules of FOPA. DE isn't as communist as NJ, NY, and MD. Open carry is defacto-legal in DE like it is in PA, but DE does allow a better means of transporting in a vehicle - which PA requires a license unless you're going to/from specific exempted places..

[WishIWasFlying]

I'm glad I asked. This has been on my mind for some time. I will certainly clear out my vehicle should I decide to drive out of PA into an unfriendly state. I may just alter my practices altogether and stop leaving my range bag in the back.

Thanks guys!