Thread: FYI

**blysccr** · November 5th, 2009, 11:47 PM

Just a FYI, apparently you can't purchase an ar lower in pa if youre under 21....kinda made me mad...

**synergy** · November 6th, 2009, 12:06 AM

Originally Posted by blysccr

Just a FYI, apparently you can't purchase an ar lower in pa if youre under 21....kinda made me mad...

Thas been a lot of talk about that on here. IMO, it's not legally accurate, but the PSP is trying to enforce that, anyway.

**blysccr** · November 6th, 2009, 12:21 AM

i was really bummed out... they are the only place local to me at school (state college) that had a pretty decent price on DPMS lowers (130) and i was gonna get it tonight and sit and look at it, instead of go partying like most college kids...so i went and tied flies instead...lol

**knight0334** · November 6th, 2009, 12:30 AM

The ATF started it.. The PSP just twisted it around.. Its gonna be a year pretty soon since this has been policy.

A virgin receiver without a shoulder stock is not a rifle or shotgun, so it is treated much like a pistol grip only shotgun - which you need to be 21 for a FFL to transfer it to you.

**GunLawyer001** · November 6th, 2009, 12:31 AM

It's been a while since the last go-round on this, but you actually can't buy any guns at all from a dealer until you're 21, except for rifles and shotguns. A stripped receiver isn't a rifle or shotgun yet. That's why you can make a pistol from a stripped, virgin AR-15 type lower, without violating the Federal law that says you can't make a handgun from a rifle without complying with the NFA.

**blysccr** · November 6th, 2009, 12:44 AM

i had no idea, i mean i was aware you could make it a handgun, but didn't put the two together. crazy how you can vote, go to war, be considered a "man" but can't buy alcohol or handguns...but i know i'm not the first one to bring that up lol

**anonymouse** · November 6th, 2009, 09:58 AM

So is a Mossberg 500 with a pistol grip only (no shoulder stock) not considered a long gun? (like this: http://www.arms.ru/Guns/drobovik/mossberg_cruiser.jpg)

Would you need to be 21 to buy one? Would a private transfer need to go through a FFL?

**knight0334** · November 6th, 2009, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by anonymouse

So is a Mossberg 500 with a pistol grip only (no shoulder stock) not considered a long gun? (like this: http://www.arms.ru/Guns/drobovik/mossberg_cruiser.jpg)

Would you need to be 21 to buy one? Would a private transfer need to go through a FFL?

It's not considered a "rifle" or "shotgun" because of the lack of shoulder stock by the ATF and federal laws/reg. So for a FFL to transfer it under federal standards you have to be 21. But the PSP doesn't considered* one to be a "firearm", so no state form to fill out. Intrastate private transfers are not regulated by the Fed Govt, and since the PSP doesn't include one to be a firearm, you can buy/sell privately as you desire.

*Although, the PSP may or may not be trying to add the PG-only shotguns as a firearm like they are doing AR-15's. I haven't bought one in awhile to say for sure about the PSP.

**GunLawyer001** · November 6th, 2009, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by knight0334

It's not considered a "rifle" or "shotgun" because of the lack of shoulder stock by the ATF and federal laws/reg. So for a FFL to transfer it under federal standards you have to be 21. But the PSP doesn't considered* one to be a "firearm", so no state form to fill out. Intrastate private transfers are not regulated by the Fed Govt, and since the PSP doesn't include one to be a firearm, you can buy/sell privately as you desire.

*Although, the PSP may or may not be trying to add the PG-only shotguns as a firearm like they are doing AR-15's. I haven't bought one in awhile to say for sure about the PSP.

The PA record of sale form is for all guns other than rifles or shotguns, I believe. So a shotgun without a stock should require both forms, and I believe it's been done that way for a long time; at least, I remember Edelman's on Rte 309 treating a PG shotgun like a handgun, and Edelman's has been gone for maybe 10 years.

**anonymouse** · November 6th, 2009, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by GunLawyer001

The PA record of sale form is for all guns other than rifles or shotguns, I believe. So a shotgun without a stock should require both forms, and I believe it's been done that way for a long time; at least, I remember Edelman's on Rte 309 treating a PG shotgun like a handgun, and Edelman's has been gone for maybe 10 years.

So what should someone do if they purchased a PG shotgun in the past through a private FTF sale without any paperwork?