Case law on using NFA firearms for self defense?

[GunLawyer001]

Here's part of what I tell people in my workshops:

If you have to defend yourself using lethal force, you bear the burden of proving your affirmative defense. You want the jury to believe that you weren't looking for trouble, that you were just going about your business, tapping an ATM machine so you could buy your kid some Pampers, and you just happened to have a MAC-10 that's the size of 2 bricks under one arm, with an extra 60 rounds of .45 ACP in a specialty assault holster under the other armpit.

Jurors may be skeptical.

A lot of NFA weapons are so much bigger and nastier-looking than a more conventional revolver or autoloading pistol, that you unnecessarily make your defense counsel's job harder, and increase your chances of spending time in jail. If you have a 1911 type weapon in your belt, you're a citizen who happens to be armed; you can still drive or climb a ladder or throw a Frisbee. But if you're harnessed up with an SBR or SBS or subgun, with several pounds of reloads, then you look an awful lot like a dedicated weapons platform.

As for cases, I heard of a sales rep for H&K, I think it was in Virginia, who had to defend himself from two aggressive dimwits, using a machinegun. It was a good shoot, but the prosecutor pursued him hard, explicitly because he had used a machinegun. He was never convicted, but he went through a lot of grief that was avoidable.

[offshorebear]

IIRC correctly there was a gun dealer who defended himself successfully with an early 20th century full auto SMG. I know the story is on the internet but I can't find it now.


What about home defense with an NFA gun, like a 10.5 inch AR? Any extra legal consequences?

[GunLawyer001]

IIRC correctly there was a gun dealer who defended himself successfully with an early 20th century full auto SMG. I know the story is on the internet but I can't find it now.


What about home defense with an NFA gun, like a 10.5 inch AR? Any extra legal consequences?

I don't have any empirical evidence, but my gut says that having an exotic weapon at home is far less likely to sway a jury against you, especially if it's something registered and not a machinegun or a DD.

If you're at home, and the trouble comes to you in the form of some lowlife busting a window and crawling in, there's no inference that you were out doing the vigilante thing. You were home, innocent as can be (just don't mention your MySpace page where you posted that you'd be away from your isolated home at 123 Main Street for 2 weeks and you hoped that nobody stole your Krugerrands, especially with your alarm service broken. "Baiting" is illegal.)

Further, I see a difference between having an SBR above the mantle, and having it under your overcoat. The latter shows a present intent for use, the former does not. You can be excused for resorting to whatever is nearest you when surprised by an intruder at a time and place and manner of his choosing.

Now, if you respond to the intruder with a 30-round burst from your registered M-16, or a custom 40mm HE/incendiary/flechette round that requires extensive forensic work to identify even the number of intruders, I'd expect that the phrase "excessive force" might be heard.

[General Geoff]

As for cases, I heard of a sales rep for H&K, I think it was in Virginia, who had to defend himself from two aggressive dimwits, using a machinegun. It was a good shoot, but the prosecutor pursued him hard, explicitly because he had used a machinegun. He was never convicted, but he went through a lot of grief that was avoidable.

That was Gary Fadden. Very bizarre set of circumstances where an HK salesman ended up shooting a bad guy who chased him in their pickup truck, with a Ruger AC556.

[FloridaState]

Are there anyout lines from the federal level other than the obvious possesionn and license requirements for NFA firearms? Im still a little confussed about regular rifles and shotguns. I am thinging about going with the sig 556 SBR to carry sometimes in my vehicle for going long distance in the state or to by cabin.

What are the restrictions on regulat rifles and shotguns that are not firearms?

[Statkowski]

"Regular" rifles and shotguns can't be carried in a vehicle loaded.

[FloridaState]

What exactly can you do with a regular shotgun or rifle than legally? Can they be locked in the trunk or locked in a secure container when not going to and from a place of related interest?

[lildobe]

What exactly can you do with a regular shotgun or rifle than legally? Can they be locked in the trunk or locked in a secure container when not going to and from a place of related interest?

You can carry long guns (Shotguns/Rifles) all you like in a car. There is no prohibition against that.

The law prohibits them from being LOADED, meaning that the ammunition needs to be in a separate container, like a zipped bag on the back seat. This law is to, ostensibly, prevent people from hunting from their cars.

So as long as the long-gun and ammo are separate, you can carry them in your car.

[Legion_Prime]

You can carry long guns (Shotguns/Rifles) all you like in a car. There is no prohibition against that.

The law prohibits them from being LOADED, meaning that the ammunition needs to be in a separate container, like a zipped bag on the back seat. This law is to, ostensibly, prevent people from hunting from their cars.

So as long as the long-gun and ammo are separate, you can carry them in your car.

If I recall the law properly, with magazine fed it's loaded magazines that must be separate, but even then the law states that being in a separate pocket of even the same bag is sufficient separation.
Hunting from cars, hahaha. Always makes me think of another board where a member talked about the passenger mirror on his car detonating. Then realizing that, while his sight line had cleared the mirror . . . the muzzle hadn't.