Several of these recent discussions pertaining to training have been both informative and fatiguing depending on your perspective. So to has the thread in the “support and suggestions” forum requesting the creation of a training forum.

What I’d like to address in this thread are some peripheral issues from several recent threads, including whether or not a training forum is indicated, but primarily training in general as it relates to a “journey”.

For example, forum member dgg9 raised a good point in Post #176 in response to a criticism of the “round chambering technique” thread when another member mentioned “… 18 pages of bickering”. He replied with “BTW, there's a lot of interesting stuff on this thread, and it's NOT about what specifically to do. It's about how to decide what to train to do. That's really the high level debate happening here, and is IMO very worthwhile to air out”. That is an outstanding point to consider in ANY thread dealing with ANY technique or TTP.

Another “back-and-forth / tit-for-tat” issue centered around Tactical Response and James Yeager in particular. The events surrounding Operation Apollo made their way around the internet several years ago and the basic facts are well known. I have never trained with TR and I have never met James so I have no personal or commercial interest linking myself to them with what I am about to convey.

Can one question whether he is qualified to teach a HRCC course? Probably but debatable. Having had the opportunity to talk to a few of his students about his course content, I have a few issues with his philosophy. However, James and crew have been teaching general firearms training for 10+ years and I have no doubt that they are probably quite adept at teaching the fundamental skill sets of basic marksmanship and gun handling. Of late they seem to have been pushing the margins of what are widely accepted safety protocols but all I know is what I’ve read on various forums. I’m still not quite sure of the context.

When starting on the path to formal training, one does need to be careful where (which schools) and on whom (which trainers) they spend their training dollars because frankly, training isn’t cheap. But at the beginning of the journey, we are learning the basic skill sets of marksmanship, gun handling, safety protocol and more often than not, perhaps a sprinkling of mindset and possibly a simulator exercise.

What I’m getting at is that initially it doesn’t really matter who you go to for the basic skill sets so long as they have a bit of history (how long they have been instructing) and can at least provide you with their pedigree (from whom did they learn) so you can get a rough idea of what to expect in terms of content.

But specifically, Weaver vs Iso, SS vs HOT, diagnostic vs non-diagnostic, or bladed stance vs squared off, etc. doesn’t really matter at this early stage because you have just begun the transition from “unconscious incompetent” to “conscious incompetent” and then hopefully to some degree of “conscious competent” by the end of your first two day or three day course. At this point you are still struggling somewhat with the basics but have no “database” (so to speak) with which to compare trainers or specific techniques. Eventually there will come a time when you can begin to decide for yourself what works and what doesn’t work FOR YOU.

On a more personal issue, I vehemently curse the GWOT for the impact it has had on the private sector training industry. I may ruffle a few feathers with what I am about to state but I think it needs to be stated. For one thing, the sheer volume of “nylon accoutrements” (MOLLE gear) and hard armor being purchased by so many in the civilian sector alarms me. Not because I don’t think civilians should be able to purchase all that stuff but because it is skewing the student’s reality. I fully acknowledge that there are professional “door-kickers” who should wear their combat gear in training and that in some high round count classes, some form of carriage system could be justified.

And long, long ago, in a galaxy far, far away, we always encouraged police and .mil types to wear their gear in training PRECISELY BECAUSE that was most likely what they’d be wearing if they ever found themselves in a lethal threat encounter. However, we now have scores of civilians wearing combat gear that they will not even have time to don let alone take advantage of if they ever hear a bump in the night. And whether or not there IS an advantage to any of that stuff is debatable. My impression is that it is driven mostly by what they “want”, based on some unfounded perception, rather than what they “need”. That I find disturbing because it is not rational.

I also believe the GWOT is the reason many are seeking training from the HSLD .mil “rock stars” who have recently begun to offer classes to the private sector. I’m certainly not suggesting that you won’t come away with a solid grounding in the basics from those guys because you certainly will. But I find the “cult like” following that flourishes around some of them disconcerting because it can become a source of closed-mindedness.

If I told you the reason the Weaver Stance utilizes such a deep bend at the support arm elbow you laugh yourself to tears. If I told you the genesis of the VFG as used on the AR15 platform you’d piss yourself laughing. Many have heard Pat Rogers say “don’t get married to your magazines”. I say don’t get married to your instructor’s TTP’s.

And just what is HSLD? Louis Awerbuck once wrote there is no such thing as an advanced gunfight. The context IIRC, is that everyone wants to attend “advanced classes” when in reality it is simply application of the basics under stress.

This is where there needs to be careful consideration as to whether or not a training forum is indicated on this board. The issues can become quite contentious but as lycan mentioned, we did a fair job at policing ourselves in synergy’s “round chambering technique” thread. I’m just not sure there is enough interest here because of the 20,000+ members, training issues don’t seem to be a popular topic.

Finally, embarking on the path to formal training is a journey. Your first class is like trying to take a drink from a fire hose. The strange thing is I don’t care who you are, you’ll never stop learning.

Col. Cooper said "Having a gun and thinking you are armed is like having a piano and thinking you are a musician". And on our website home page we unabashedly state "Most people would rather pretend".

Harsh words indeed ……. but not nearly as harsh as being unprepared for trouble.