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  1. #1
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    Default RFID implants in health care bill

    http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text

    The Obama Health care bill under Class II (Paragraph 1, Section B) specifically includes in it's lists of things that must be in registered in the NATIONAL MEDICAL DEVICE REGISTRY: ‘‘(ii) a class II device that is implantable."

    Then on page 1004 it describes what the term "data" means in paragraph 1, section B:

    14 ‘‘(B) In this paragraph, the term ‘data’ refers to in
    15formation respecting a device described in paragraph (1),
    16 including claims data, patient survey data, standardized
    17 analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of
    18 data from disparate data environments, electronic health
    19 records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the
    20 Secretary"

    What exactly is a class II device that is implantable? Lets see...


    Approved by the FDA, a class II implantable device is a "implantable radiofrequency transponder system for patient identification and health information." The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as "claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary."

    It looks like they are seeking to register anyone that has the devices... not necessarily push them on everyone...
    Last edited by archangel689; September 2nd, 2009 at 11:17 PM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Implant chips....

    Straight out of Revelation and prophecy. I've been given to laughing at those who call Obama Anti-Christ, but more and more I'm wondering if perhaps the time hasn't come.
    "Never give up, never surrender!" Commander Peter Quincy Taggart

  3. #3
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Jeez.

    Expand the quote:
    ‘(g)(1) The Secretary shall establish a national medical device registry (in this subsection referred to as the ‘registry’) to facilitate analysis of postmarket safety and outcomes data on each device that--
    ‘(A) is or has been used in or on a patient;

    ‘(B) is--

    ‘(i) a class III device;

    ‘(ii) a class II device that is implantable, life-supporting, or life-sustaining.
    Let's turn to the Wikipedia for medical device classes:
    Class II: General Controls with Special Controls

    Class II devices are those for which general controls alone are insufficient to assure safety and effectiveness, and additional existing methods are available to provide such assurances. Therefore, Class II devices are also subject to special controls in addition to the general controls of Class I devices. Special controls may include special labeling requirements, mandatory performance standards, and postmarket surveillance.[2] Devices in Class II are held to a higher level of assurance than Class I devices that they will perform as indicated and will not cause injury or harm to patient or user. Devices in this class are typically non-invasive and include x-ray machines, PACS, powered wheelchairs, infusion pumps, surgical drapes, surgical needles and suture material,acupuncture needles.

    [edit] Class III: General Controls and Premarket Approval

    A Class III device is one for which insufficient information exists to assure safety and effectiveness solely through the general or special controls sufficient for Class I or Class II devices. Such a device needs premarket approval, a scientific review to ensure the device's safety and effectiveness, in addition to the general controls of Class I. Class III devices are described as those for which "insufficient information exists to determine that general controls are sufficient to provide reasonable assurance of its safety and effectiveness or that application of special controls ... would provide such assurance and if, in addition, the device is life-supporting or life-sustaining, or for a use which is of substantial importance in preventing impairment of human health, or if the device presents a potential unreasonable risk of illness or injury."[3]

    Examples of Class III devices which require a premarket approval include replacement heart valves, silicone gel-filled breast implants, implanted cerebral stimulators, implantable pacemaker pulse generators and endosseous (intra-bone) implants (with the exception of root-form endosseous dental implants which were recently reclassified as Class II).
    So they're going to make a registry of x-ray machines, infusion pumps, titty implants, and pacemakers.

    Sure, you REALLY want those things taken care of under recalls. I certainly want to know the infusion pump that's working on me has all manufacturer recalls taken care of.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Your edit adds more information. And sure, those chips have been coming around for a while. My dog has one.

    And yes, you want a registry of those chips, especially if they degrade.

    And as someone who has seen people affected by advanced alzheimers, it would be nice if the cops can just scan grandpa to know who to call to pick him up when he goes for a walk in just his robe and slipper in the winter.

    Fear when the make them mandatory.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Quote Originally Posted by archangel689 View Post
    http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text

    The Obama Health care bill under Class II (Paragraph 1, Section B) specifically includes in it's lists of things that must be in registered in the NATIONAL MEDICAL DEVICE REGISTRY: ‘‘(ii) a class II device that is implantable."

    Then on page 1004 it describes what the term "data" means in paragraph 1, section B:

    14 ‘‘(B) In this paragraph, the term ‘data’ refers to in
    15formation respecting a device described in paragraph (1),
    16 including claims data, patient survey data, standardized
    17 analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of
    18 data from disparate data environments, electronic health
    19 records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the
    20 Secretary"

    What exactly is a class II device that is implantable? Lets see...


    Approved by the FDA, a class II implantable device is a "implantable radiofrequency transponder system for patient identification and health information." The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as "claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary."

    It looks like they are seeking to register anyone that has the devices... not necessarily push them on everyone...
    Oh for the love of God people.. and for the 3 pages of other nutters screaming "Obama will require implants!!"

    /sigh

    The Following Devices (and others like them) are the subject..

    * Glenoid Fossa prosthesis
    * Mandibular condyle prosthesis
    * Temporomandibular Joint (TMJ) prosthesis
    * Abdominal Aortic Aneurysm Stent Grafts
    * Automatic implantable cardioverter/defibrillator
    * Cardiovascular permanent implantable pacemaker electrode
    * Implantable pacemaker pulse generator
    * Replacement heart valve (mechanical only)
    * Implanted cerebellar stimulator
    * Implanted diaphragmatic/phrenic nerve stimulator
    * Implantable infusion pumps
    * Silicone Gel-Filled Breast Implants
    * Cultured Epidermal Autografts


    That being said... there is a current industry that is researching bio-implants for record tracking which (while very spooky and end of day's like) technically would be useful in medical record keeping.

    However, I'd love to see what happens the first time they try to forcibly implant someone with something like that.. Go ahead.. I'll put on my raincoat for the shit storm that follows..


    I could be wrong though.. It could take someone an hour just to see the full ramifications and ultimate end of a single fucking paragraph in this bill.. Refer here, insert this into that, take this part of a 20 year old law and change it and amend it like so.. but they don't include the original laws and round and round and /barf.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Morel42 View Post
    I could be wrong though.. It could take someone an hour just to see the full ramifications and ultimate end of a single fucking paragraph in this bill.. Refer here, insert this into that, take this part of a 20 year old law and change it and amend it like so.. but they don't include the original laws and round and round and /barf.
    And that is a big part of the problem. Real universal health care could be spelled out in less than 250 pages. The fact that it's over 1,000 pages of gobbledygook means it is de facto trash, and should be treated as such.

    The Supreme Court really should bring back the doctrine of unconstitutional vagueness.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    .gov has some really evil SOB's behind the curtain....
    WAKE UP OR WACO!

  8. #8
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Same chip you have put in your dog for ID in case it gets lost. The "beautiful people" girls around the Miami are and in CA have them implanted in their shoulders with their credit card numbers on them. That way they don't have to carry a purse to buy drinks at the fancy clubs. Been doing it for years.
    Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Skipping the argument about what this potentially portion of legislation actually means, the issue of implantable rfid chips for medical tracking is a fairly interesting one.
    On the one hand, it would be invaluable for emergency patient care, if tied into a suitably designed patient info database. On the other, as soon as it becomes common, expected it to become nearly compulsory/universal. As soon as it becomes universal, expect it to be expanded to other uses.

    If you're robbed and beaten/shot, it would be great if the EMT's who arrive had a way to quickly know that you were diabetic, allergic to medication, or had any conditions.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: RFID implants in health care bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Helter View Post
    Skipping the argument about what this potentially portion of legislation actually means, the issue of implantable rfid chips for medical tracking is a fairly interesting one.
    On the one hand, it would be invaluable for emergency patient care, if tied into a suitably designed patient info database. On the other, as soon as it becomes common, expected it to become nearly compulsory/universal. As soon as it becomes universal, expect it to be expanded to other uses.

    If you're robbed and beaten/shot, it would be great if the EMT's who arrive had a way to quickly know that you were diabetic, allergic to medication, or had any conditions.
    Yes, but the same people who don't want to buy EZ-Pass, for fear of being tracked, would be opposed to it. I can't see Congress requiring ID implants when we can't even get our act straight on a national ID.

    That said, RFID is NOT secure, not by any stretch. Yes, more cars use it for keyless entry and 'push-button starters', but someone nearby CAN lift the code and try to steal your car. Until that is taken care of, I wouldn't want my medical records implanted into my arm for anyone to read.

    That said, I do have a car that uses RFID for entrance and starting, and I've thought about what it might take to get that thing implanted so I don't forget my keys - ever.

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