Open carry training memo for LEO dept's in PA [final draft]

[Nate]

In order to have a "loaded" firearm (handgun) in a vehicle, you must have a LTC.

If you have a LTC, you can have the loaded firearm on you, on your dash, on your seat, in your glove box, under your seat, etc.

If you do NOT have a LTC, either because you aren't old enough to have one or you choose not to have one you cannot have a loaded firearm on you inside the vehicle, nor can the firearm by loaded while it is in the vehicle. It doesn't matter where the unloaded firearm is, just that it is unloaded.

While double checking my info (because I want to make sure I'm 100% correct) I noticed there is a change in the wording of exception (4).

It used to be written that the firearm must be unloaded and the firearm and ammo needed to be in seperate containers. However this is the was the law is written now;

(4) any persons engaged in target shooting with a firearm, if such persons are at or are going to or from their places of assembly or target practice and if, while going to or from their places of assembly or target practice, the firearm is not loaded.

Notice, the need for being carried in seperate containers has been removed. I checked both my current 2007 version and last years (2006) and the wording is the same in both. I threw out my 2005 version, so I can't check and see of thats when the section was changed.

Thanks once again Steve for giving us good info.

[Steve in PA]

Apparently the defintion of "loaded" is still the same, meaning seperate containers for the firearm and ammo.

I would recommend carrying them this way until things are clarified.

However, the part about carrying an unloaded handgun in a vehicle without a LTC is still okay. Just put the ammo in a container, example....a box of ammo inside some other type of container, range bag, ammo can, etc.

[Pa. Patriot]

I can think of one Organization that should receive a "COPY", The Municipal
Police Officers Training and Education Commission of The Commonwealth of
Pennsylvania, Hershey, Pa. ...

http://www.mpoetc.state.pa.us/mpotrs/site/default.asp?mpotrsNav=|29764|

To whom would I address this? Opinions?

Choices:

• Chairman
• Executive Director
• Administrative Officer
• Director of Training

==========================

Same question for the PA Sheriff's Association.
http://www.pasheriffs.org/

Choices are:

• Executive Director
• Solicitor
• President

[Skuggi]

each and every one of'em IMO

[Skuggi]

Apparently the defintion of "loaded" is still the same, meaning seperate containers for the firearm and ammo.

I would recommend carrying them this way until things are clarified.

However, the part about carrying an unloaded handgun in a vehicle without a LTC is still okay. Just put the ammo in a container, example....a box of ammo inside some other type of container, range bag, ammo can, etc.

Hey steve, just wondering, because that's what I do since I dont have to worry about this anymore and I'm just wondering how crazy this law can get.

Have your pistol on the passenger seat or back seat, loaded magazine in your glove box or center console?

Now, if those arent considered containers due to them being built into the car itself. I'll give another example as well.

We used to have a minivan, it's been out of commission since the tranny went and sitting in the warehouse, but we had a removable console you put int he middle. not mounted down or anything, it was also a cooler so it had a carrying strap.

Now, pistol once again in the back seat with the magazine in that console.

In the spirt of the law, I dont think this would be a good thing, but I was just thinking of the technicality of it.

[Pa. Patriot]

each and every one of'em IMO

Why didn't I think of that

[Pa. Patriot]

PD list updated on original post.
Just printed a copy for the Lehighton PD due to reading the account of events posted in this very disturbing thread:
http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum46/3148.html

[Mtn Jack]

Just a note to let you know a hand delivered copy of the training memo was given to the Beaver county scheriff.The girl in charge full time i may add for permits is wonderfull and said she is going to hand out copys to all the deputies also. I left her with a couple of web sites including this one. We now have informed Beaver county.A very nice visit i might say. Mtn Jack

[Emptymag]

Just a note to let you know a hand delivered copy of the training memo was given to the Beaver county scheriff.The girl in charge full time i may add for permits is wonderfull and said she is going to hand out copys to all the deputies also. I left her with a couple of web sites including this one. We now have informed Beaver county.A very nice visit i might say. Mtn Jack

Speaking as an "OC-curious" () observer, I gotta give you a pat on the back Mtn Jack! (hey, that rhymes.)

Delivering that in person is likely to be the most well-received way to go about it. If only one officer in that dept. learns something from your efforts, that's one more than if you had done nothing. I have a feeling that more than one person will learn something new from this.

Good work.

[chesire17201]

In order to have a "loaded" firearm (handgun) in a vehicle, you must have a LTC.

If you have a LTC, you can have the loaded firearm on you, on your dash, on your seat, in your glove box, under your seat, etc.

If you do NOT have a LTC, either because you aren't old enough to have one or you choose not to have one you cannot have a loaded firearm on you inside the vehicle, nor can the firearm by loaded while it is in the vehicle. It doesn't matter where the unloaded firearm is, just that it is unloaded.

While double checking my info (because I want to make sure I'm 100% correct) I noticed there is a change in the wording of exception (4).

It used to be written that the firearm must be unloaded and the firearm and ammo needed to be in seperate containers. However this is the was the law is written now;

(4) any persons engaged in target shooting with a firearm, if such persons are at or are going to or from their places of assembly or target practice and if, while going to or from their places of assembly or target practice, the firearm is not loaded.

Notice, the need for being carried in seperate containers has been removed. I checked both my current 2007 version and last years (2006) and the wording is the same in both. I threw out my 2005 version, so I can't check and see of thats when the section was changed.

o.k. curious about the statute, i don't see anywhere where it mentions "loaded", only concealed, i would take this as either loaded or UN-loaded....