Neg rep and sigs

[imperialism2024]

At first in this thread, I was in favor of putting neg rep comments in sig lines.

But as I read through the posts, it does seem to add to the rudeness and unfriendliness that is not that common around here, but still crops up once in a while.

As for me, I've given neg rep a few (several?) times, for violations of forum etiquette, from making multiple threads about the same topic, to personal attacks, to just making PAFOA look bad in general. I've never given it for disagreeing with me... in fact, many times I've given out pos rep to people with whom I disagree, but who articulate their points well. Now, if you're going to disagree in a crude and/or obnoxious manner, you might find a little red giftbox from me, though I try to refrain from that course of action if I can help it.

And all the neg rep I've gotten is usually filled with the profanity-laden personal attacks, typically based on my disagreement with them, my political views, or my lack of membership in the NRA (yes, yes that last once actually happened). I shrug it off, perhaps giggle a little, and move on with my life.

[Coffee]

I'm new here so forgive me if this has been discussed (the links in post #1 of the sticky discussing rep are not working). And I've been searching for 'visitor' in this forum with no results.

The problem with negative reputation is people use it to say "I disagree" rather than "this post is horrendously wrong and contains incorrect and illegal information." The latter is what it is meant to be used for.

I think the problem with that is two fold .

1) The people that are apparently particularly vulgar or vicious in their PM/Rep messages are certainly going to recognize their own words , and then feel like they must lash out yet again for being " outted " if even anonymously so .

2) The aforementioned language/message of these comments most likely wouldnt be kosher for public display under the existing posting guidelines for vulgarity , personal attacks etc . So it would be kinda pointless if their really as bad as they are portrayed to be .

Seems the desire is to point out things that should not be, and because people know their neg rep comments are not to be discussed publicly they can be a little harsh in the wording.

Just in case you have not thought about it - it is possible to enable visitor messaging and enable management of those visitor messages by the user. So undesirable or obsolete messages can be soft deleted.

Because visitor messages are 'semi' public the wording might be a little kinder if the helpful, but not positive comments, were left there in lieu of negative rep. Which should reduce the amount of work for the staff, and make the atmosphere on this forum even better than it already is.

Hopefully my wording is not too obscure.

.

[pirateron]

The problem with negative reputation is people use it to say "I disagree" rather than "this post is horrendously wrong and contains incorrect and illegal information." The latter is what it is meant to be used for.

Word.

Too many in this thread have admitted to using the rep as a way for disagreeing or having varying opinions. Use it for what it is meant and there shouldn't be problems. As was posted earlier, if you can't debate a difference in opinion in a civil manner, don't post, but don't neg rep either.

[emsjeep]

Word.

Too many in this thread have admitted to using the rep as a way for disagreeing or having varying opinions. Use it for what it is meant and there shouldn't be problems. As was posted earlier, if you can't debate a difference in opinion in a civil manner, don't post, but don't neg rep either.

The rep system is whatever the majority of users say it is. If people start using it to say that your opinion has been evidenced as being incorrect and that you should stop clinging to it, so be it. If they decide to use it to say that you are unconstructively straying from the mainstream for no reason and to no possible innovation, then fine. As long as your negative rep is civil why does anyone care what it is used for? Its our rep, if I rep people for having opposing opinions I accept that I may be neg repped for the same thing. Its not what people get neg repped for that is the issue, it is the level of civility with which it is done and nothing more that is the real issue here.

[Asmodeus6]

So possibly I should negative rep you for supporting a form of "mob rule" or "mob mentality" just because I disagree with your post?

I just don't see that as appropriate. Differing opinions is not wrong / incorrect and or dangerously erroneous information being spread. It is often the case where legal information is presented for discussion here on pafoa. So I think things need to remain held to a higher standard. While no one should take legal advice from anyone but their attorney, there is no doubt legalities concerning many many situations are discussed here.

We aren't arguing about carboard box cutters here. These are guns, and the 10 billion miles of red tape concerning owning, transporting, building, modding, and firing them. I think the underlying seriousness of the topic necessitates we all watch what comes out of our mouth and we keep opinons and facts as seperate issues. DanP explained its intended purpose, and it is his show.

[Emptymag]

(snip)...

...

The problem with negative reputation is people use it to say "I disagree" rather than "this post is horrendously wrong and contains incorrect and illegal information." The latter is what it is meant to be used for.

Word.

Too many in this thread have admitted to using the rep as a way for disagreeing or having varying opinions. Use it for what it is meant and there shouldn't be problems. As was posted earlier, if you can't debate a difference in opinion in a civil manner, don't post, but don't neg rep either.

The rep system is whatever the majority of users say it is. If people start using it to say that your opinion has been evidenced as being incorrect and that you should stop clinging to it, so be it. If they decide to use it to say that you are unconstructively straying from the mainstream for no reason and to no possible innovation, then fine. As long as your negative rep is civil why does anyone care what it is used for? Its our rep, if I rep people for having opposing opinions I accept that I may be neg repped for the same thing. Its not what people get neg repped for that is the issue, it is the level of civility with which it is done and nothing more that is the real issue here.

ORLY?
Perhaps you'll want to read danp's post again.
At least the last line about "civility" is mostly right.

So possibly I should negative rep you for supporting a form of "mob rule" or "mob mentality" just because I disagree with your post?

I just don't see that as appropriate. Differing opinions is not wrong / incorrect and or dangerously erroneous information being spread. It is often the case where legal information is presented for discussion here on pafoa. So I think things need to remain held to a higher standard. While no one should take legal advice from anyone but their attorney, there is no doubt legalities concerning many many situations are discussed here.

We aren't arguing about carboard box cutters here. These are guns, and the 10 billion miles of red tape concerning owning, transporting, building, modding, and firing them. I think the underlying seriousness of the topic necessitates we all watch what comes out of our mouth and we keep opinons and facts as seperate issues. DanP explained its intended purpose, and it is his show.

There you go making sense again.

[emsjeep]

So possibly I should negative rep you for supporting a form of "mob rule" or "mob mentality" just because I disagree with your post?

I just don't see that as appropriate. Differing opinions is not wrong / incorrect and or dangerously erroneous information being spread. It is often the case where legal information is presented for discussion here on pafoa. So I think things need to remain held to a higher standard. While no one should take legal advice from anyone but their attorney, there is no doubt legalities concerning many many situations are discussed here.

We aren't arguing about carboard box cutters here. These are guns, and the 10 billion miles of red tape concerning owning, transporting, building, modding, and firing them. I think the underlying seriousness of the topic necessitates we all watch what comes out of our mouth and we keep opinons and facts as seperate issues. DanP explained its intended purpose, and it is his show.

Indeed you do make sense...

If you want to neg rep me for that I have no problem with it as long as you are civil and explain how or why you disagree and know that you can expect the same measure back from me when and if you represent yourself the same way to me...

This is the threat that assures that neg rep is passed out for good reason, and why the only mod intervention should be to make sure that people remain civil in thier comments through the forum that they run and own. Lets go with the "its their/danp's house" idea for a minute. If I had a number of guests over and one told another one to go fuck himself and punched him in the living room, I would throw him out. Likewise, if another guest told someone to go fuck himself and punched him, but waited to do it until they were alone in the kitchen I would throw him out too...and I expect the guy that got beat up in the kitchen would come out and tell us all about what just happened...

[Asmodeus6]

Indeed you do make sense...

If you want to neg rep me for that I have no problem with it as long as you are civil and explain how or why you disagree and know that you can expect the same measure back from me when and if you represent yourself the same way to me...

I'm discarding the example post these statements as this is polite inclination that you will simply neg rep back because you got dinged for something you said.

THIS is the EXACT REASON why the rep system is not for "disagreements". Childish, stubborn, and immature people. Now while you were at least eloquent enough to politely threaten me with negative rep in return, (as if that somehow increases the maturity level of the exchange you propose.) many other WILL not even do that.

Thankfully the management understands this petty nature inherent in people who argue on the internets and have set the rules in accordance to prevent these kind of exchanges out of spite. And provide a lasting record of every time person A and person B did not agree so they started a rep war, and then called their other forum buddies in to ding the other guy. Which then turns into a popularity contest.

ALL very unfit for a public forum. While all these things exist in any form of public communication / social interaction. Why increase the focus on highschool level interaction and politics?

Another thing I can tell you coming from being an admin/vendor/participant on many MANY forums for the last 10 years, (that should be abundantly clear by this point as you have been repeatedly told by the staff / ownership) that this is not a democracy, and while you continue to beat the dead horse in the suggestion forum like many people do despite that fact... if they have said it is this way, and staying this way. That's it, you are just beating your head off a wall.

I'm obviously not going to negative rep you, it was simply an example. I refuse to start such an exchange for the reasons mentioned above.

[emsjeep]

I'm discarding the example post these statements as this is polite inclination that you will simply neg rep back because you got dinged for something you said.

THIS is the EXACT REASON why the rep system is not for "disagreements". Childish, stubborn, and immature people. Now while you were at least eloquent enough to politely threaten me with negative rep in return, (as if that somehow increases the maturity level of the exchange you propose.) many other WILL not even do that.

Thankfully the management understands this petty nature inherent in people who argue on the internets and have set the rules in accordance to prevent these kind of exchanges out of spite. And provide a lasting record of every time person A and person B did not agree so they started a rep war, and then called their other forum buddies in to ding the other guy. Which then turns into a popularity contest.

ALL very unfit for a public forum. While all these things exist in any form of public communication / social interaction. Why increase the focus on highschool level interaction and politics?

Another thing I can tell you coming from being an admin/vendor/participant on many MANY forums for the last 10 years, (that should be abundantly clear by this point as you have been repeatedly told by the staff / ownership) that this is not a democracy, and while you continue to beat the dead horse in the suggestion forum like many people do despite that fact... if they have said it is this way, and staying this way. That's it, you are just beating your head off a wall.

I'm obviously not going to negative rep you, it was simply an example. I refuse to start such an exchange for the reasons mentioned above.

You are waaaaay off...I thought I was speaking in general terms, its not a threat. All I said was that if you postive or negitive rep me then it is reasonable to expect the same back when you do the same thing I did, if that is a point of disagreement or illegal advice or whatever. If you set the threshold low, then you will treated with the terms that you dictate in doing so, if you set the threshold high, as it seems is most appropriate here, then thats great too and you will be repped based on how you rep others.

[Montanya]

I really think that at times rep just erupts into a big e-peen contest and a childish game of "He touched me first" Let's be adults here folks, and if you aren't an adult, fake it. One upping someone because they negative repped you is just childish, posting their feedback in your sig is even moreso. If you disagree with someone post then you disagree, if someone is offering flat out bad advise, illegal advise, then neg rep them if you are so inclined. If I neg rep someone my typical line in it is "I disagree" that is all I feel the need to explain to someone. If I positive rep someone I usually am more likely to post a funny comment. Lets all just try and be the better person rather than stooping to the level of some jackass that feels the childish need to post an idiot comment to go with their negative rep.