Billions for highspeed trains

[Dredly]

I'm sure this will somehow benefit the nation... no fucking clue how but it will I guess?

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...-speed-trains/

WASHINGTON – The Republicans attacking President Barack Obama's economic stimulus package point to a project they dub the "Sin Express" — a high speed rail link between Anaheim, Calif., site of Disneyland, and Las Vegas.

Not so fast.

In fact, competition for the $8 billion in mass transit construction is just beginning. Backers of numerous other planned high-speed rail corridors around the country are making their case for the money.

They notably include a Midwest initiative long supported by someone with even more clout than Sen. Harry Reid, D-Nev., who strongly supports the Anaheim-Las Vegas line. That would be former Illinois Sen. Obama.

It was Obama's White House that, in the final hours of negotiations over the $787 billion stimulus bill, sought and won the big sum for high-speed rail projects, far above what either the House or Senate had passed. Reid was happy to agree but there's no guarantee the Anaheim-Las Vegas line will win dollars, to be determined by the Transportation Department.

Also in the running are proposed high-speed corridors in the Northeast, the Northwest, Florida and the South.

Howard Learner, president of the Chicago-based Environmental Law and Policy Center, a group promoting a Midwest high-speed rail network, said his area is in excellent position to capture a good chunk of that money. The Federal Railroad Administration, he said, has recognized the Midwest initiative connecting Chicago and 11 metropolitan areas within 400 miles as the system most ready to go.

He and others brushed aside claims that the $8 billion was set aside for Reid's favorite. Obama, who expressed strong interest in high-speed rail investment during the campaign, and his chief of staff Rahm Emanuel, are both from Chicago. Obama's transportation secretary, Ray Lahood, also is from Illinois. So is the Senate's no. 2 Democrat, Richard Durbin.

Quentin Kopp, chairman of the California High-Speed Rail Authority, said he was "delighted to see that the momentum has shifted in favor of high-speed train transportation." He outlined $2 billion in state projects that could be initiated before the Sept. 30, 2012, deadline for committing the $8 billion. Those include electrification of the line from San Jose to San Francisco, home to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

But Reid's involvement in crafting the bill still made him and the Las Vegas line a target.

"Billions of dollars for a sin express train from Los Angeles to Las Vegas. Necessary? I don't think so," said Rep. Mike Simpson, R-Idaho.

"Tell me how spending $8 billion in this bill to have a high-speed rail line between Los Angeles and Las Vegas is going to help the construction worker in my district," said House Republican leader John Boehner, whose district is just north of Cincinnati.

Actually, some of the money might ride his way. One offshoot of the Midwest network would connect the Ohio cities of Cleveland, Columbus and Cincinnati.

Advocates of the Anaheim-Las Vegas line envision using the futuristic magnetic levitation or maglev technology, where trains zoom on an air cushion created by powerful magnets instead of wheels. Obama recently cited the maglev system in Shanghai, China, as an example next-generation transit.

"Our prospects are certainly good," said Neil Cummings, president of American Magline Group, a private partnership that is promoting the Maglev train that will carry passengers the 268 miles between the two cities at speeds of up to 310 miles per hour. Last year Congress approved $45 million for environmental and other studies.

Anaheim Mayor Curt Pringle, a member of the California-Nevada Super Speed Train Commission, said that beyond the goals of connecting two tourist destinations, easing congestion and improving the environment, the link is important because of fast population growth in the two areas. "I think this one will compete well."

Cummings said they could begin the first phase of the project, linking Anaheim and Las Vegas with local airports, within the next 18 months. The estimated completion cost is about $12 billion.

The original House and Senate stimulus bills contained $1-3 billion for rail projects. But when the two chambers met to negotiate a compromise, Emanuel proposed a significant boost. Obama's chief of staff told reporters that the White House decided to come in at the end of the legislative process as a dramatic way of promoting infrastructure investment that had a national quality.

My favorite part is this piece:

The original House and Senate stimulus bills contained $1-3 billion for rail projects. But when the two chambers met to negotiate a compromise, Emanuel proposed a significant boost. Obama's chief of staff told reporters that the White House decided to come in at the end of the legislative process as a dramatic way of promoting infrastructure investment that had a national quality.

[H.E. Pennypacker]

A more integrated commuter rail system across the nation would be a great thing, IMO. It can relieve congested roadways and give people who fly a viable second mode of transportation. It is also far more efficient and clean than air/road travel, assuming you can fill the train up.

[phill]

A more integrated commuter rail system across the nation would be a great thing, IMO. It can relieve congested roadways and give people who fly a viable second mode of transportation. It is also far more efficient and clean than air/road travel, assuming you can fill the train up.

The chicago to St. Louis leg has had two wrecks in the last six months and involved a total of 72 passengers between the two. It is not uncommon to see the train between the state capitol and chicago have only 10 or 12 people board and only have a like number going from the south. The midwest does not have the mindset for mass transit.

[bloomautomatic]

Here's one in your backyard (if you're from SW PA.) California University is planning a $250 million maglev project to connect the main campus w/ the football field, Jefferson student housing, and the Center in the Woods senior center.

I'd like to know how they figure "15,000 riders daily." a quick googling says Cal U has about 8,000 students, and the town of California is about 5,000. out of that, a small fraction would have use for this.

As for the high speed train infrastructure through the US. I agree it would be great if we had a rail transit system like Europe, but like the dollar coin, it's a good idea that just won't get used. America is a nation of drivers. It will take a lot of culture change to get people to start taking the train places. Building a system would be the first step, but how many years would it take before people start using it as their primary mode of travel? If this stimulus package was so crucial that it had to be approved in record time, it should focus on solving the problems right now, not trying to make long term changes that may never pay off.

If you want to spend money on rails, I think increasing cargo train capacities would have a more meaningful effect. Reducing the cost of shipping goods directly benefits the American consumer and manufacturers.

Vince

http://www.newsblaze.com/story/20090.../topstory.html

Shovel-ready' project could move forward within 90 days of funding

CALIFORNIA, Pa., Jan. 9 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- California University of Pennsylvania andPittsburgh-based U.S. Maglev Development Corp. are urging lawmakers to include Cal U's urban maglev demonstration project in the proposed $750 billion federal economic stimulus legislation now under discussion on Capitol Hill.

Congress is expected to pass the economic stimulus package within weeks, and President-elect Barack Obama has said he hopes to sign the completed bill into law early in his administration.

The Cal U Maglev Sky Shuttle project is "shovel-ready" and meets the requirements of the stimulus plan, university administrators and Maglev officials note. Construction can begin within 90 days after funding is made available, and the low-impact, "green technology" project will enhance productivity for the University, the region and the nation.

"The project has the potential to create hundreds of jobs here in southwesternPennsylvania," said California University President Angelo Armenti, Jr. "This could position the region as the hub of an emerging industry with benefits nationwide."

Since 2001, more than $40 million in federal, state and industry funds has been invested in Cal U's urban maglev project. Designed to accommodate both passenger and cargo vehicles, it will demonstrate the value of magnetic levitation technology in hilly urban settings.

Maglev components have been fabricated in westernPennsylvania and a test track has been constructed by General Atomics inSan Diego, Calif. Testing has been conducted there during the past three years and is expected to be completed in 2009.

"We have done our homework," said President Armenti. "The engineering and design and the required environmental work for the first phase of the $250 million project are complete. If the funding is made available, the urban maglev group can start excavating, build the substructure, and erect the support columns and guideway for the Sky Shuttle."

The project's first phase, requiring an estimated $50 million, would allow for construction of a 2,200-foot dual-use guideway, Intermodal Center and stations. Subsequent phases, requiring $200 million, would bring the system from Cal U's upper campus, which includes student housing and athletic facilities, downhill to the main campus inCalifornia Borough.

Once the project is completed, some 15,000 riders are expected to use the maglev daily, said David O'Loughlin, president of U.S. Maglev Development.

The $250 million total system would be able to move people or cargo over a route more than 4 miles long. It would carry passengers from upper-campus parking areas to the lower campus, where parking is being realigned because of safety concerns. Plans also call for a stop at The Center in the Woods, a senior center not far from the campus.

At an international conference last month inSan Diego, both U.S. Sen. Arlen Specter and Pennsylvania Auditor General Jack Wagner spoke in favor of the Sky Shuttle at Cal U.

"I am hopeful thatCalifornia University's urban maglev demonstration project will move forward as a new administration sets fresh priorities inWashington, D.C.," President Armenti said.

[reverserboy]

I agree it would be great if we had a rail transit system like Europe, but like the dollar coin, it's a good idea that just won't get used. America is a nation of drivers. It will take a lot of culture change to get people to start taking the train places. Building a system would be the first step, but how many years would it take before people start using it as their primary mode of travel?

That depends on the area/region. In places where there is lots of traffic congestion people will take the train. Unlike a bus,a train is almost never affected by road traffic conditions & is less affected by weather conditions such as snow. Have you ever been on a commuter passenger train at rush hour??

If you want to spend money on rails, I think increasing cargo train capacities would have a more meaningful effect. Reducing the cost of shipping goods directly benefits the American consumer and manufacturers.

And hopefully getting some tractor trailers off the roads.

[Dredly]

So maybe someone can tell me how my tax money going to add a high speed train in California or Chicago is going to have any benefit to me?

I'm all in favor of metro transit, but not on my fucking dime!

[customloaded]

During my two year tenure of working in philly, I lived in HBG. I refused to move to the cess pool and communted 90% of the time via Amtrak. A monthly ticket at the time was $300.00 bucks for unlimited monthly trips.

I figured in would cost me between $1000.00-$1200.00 a month if I drove to include vehicle maintainance, turnpike tolls, fuel, and parking in Philly.

I could be in my office in 1.5 hrs at Fifth and Market in Philly if I drove vs the standard three hour one way commute if I took the train, front door to office. However, I usually took my laptop and other work home and used the time on the train to work. Never had to worry about traffic congestion, accidents, road conditions, construction delays etc...

At the time, they were using Diesel locomotive engines for the power source for the train. Today, they are using electric. The weird part is that they had used electric years before but stopped and went to Diesel. It takes longer for Diesel than electric because they can't slow down and speed up as fast as Electric. Electric seemed to me to be much more efficient.

When I left that position, there had been talk of a magnetic train route from Pittsburgh to Philly. Many of the commuters loved the idea of a commute by train using different technology. The standard time was said to only be an hour or a little more from HBG to Philly, including stops but who knows, no Magnetic rails has been put up yet!!! LOL
The Amtrak trains I rode were almost always full and I think, many people would be surprized to learn that hundreds of people commute daily from HBG to Phillly via Amtrak.

I personally love travel by train, no stress!!! Just is inefficient in time vs cost in my opinion for any type of travel for pleasure, depending on what you want to do for travel. I came home from GA for New Years (2009) and went to NYC. Train up and train back, took 3 hrs each way. Round trip ticket cost was $80.00. You cannot drive from HBG to NYC round trip in six hours and pay $80.00. Plus, I knew I would hung over on the way home...LOL

The only issue I had with the whole trip was the inability to carry concealed. Other than that, it was a superb trip.

[reverserboy]

So maybe someone can tell me how my tax money going to add a high speed train in California or Chicago is going to have any benefit to me?

It won't. How does giving 40 billion to Bank of America benefit you?? I would rather see a rail line if it was my choice.

Building a passenger rail line thrugh the desert is a huge waste of money however.

Sometimes our tax dollars are used in ways that don't directly benefit us. For example...I live in Bangor & drive a 4wd suv. I don't need the roads in town plowed even though I help pay for it. It's open to debate if this or that spending is worth it.

How do farm subsidies benefit city dwellers?? Has the price of food items not gone up in the last 18 months or so?? See what I'm getting at??

[reverserboy]

Electric seemed to me to be much more efficient.

It depends on the type of equipment. Some electiric trains will really haul ass. BUT electric systems have their drawbacks. They are more prone to weather related problems than diesels. AND if the power plant is not nuke...there is still a smokestack...just in someone else's neighborhood.

Isn't it cool to ride past a traffic jam at 60mph in a train??

[andrewjs18]

amen, but it's no fun standing up the entire trip either...that's how a lot of trains are with Septa.