Does anyone else own a Thomspon "tommy" gun? If so, please step in.

[dlclarkii]

I just got this Thompson 1927 A-1 T1 last week and I took it to the range today for the first time and this gun was a real pain in the ass to shoot. I have a few questions for anyone else that has a tommy. I used 230g 45 ACP by Remington as recommended by the manufacturer.

First here's the Tommy:


First question, I used the 30 round stick to shoot my very first round. I released the bolt in it's locked position and my first round was loaded in the chamber. I aimed and pulled the trigger and nothing. WTF? I inspected the gun, checked to make sure the safety was off and attempted to fire and nothing. I did this inspection a couple more times and finally the gun fired. Is this normal on the first use? I typically except any gun to fire when ever I pull the triger. What happened?

Second question, I also have a 50 round drum, I loaded the drum per the instructions and wound the spring 9-11 clicks. Half way through spending ammo, the drum appeared to need to be wound again? The instructions didn't say that? The spring inside wasn't tight enough to push the latter half of the ammo out of the drum. Every ten rounds I had to wound it another click. Is this normal? No wonder why the GI's never used the drum in WWII.

Third, see the pictures below. Because the cartridges were not tight in the drum (see the above question as why) the cartridges started jamming in the gun's chamber. The bolt was frozen shut and after softly hitting the bolt backwards I was able to lock the bolt and release the drum. The bolt froze because of this piece which I'm not sure what it's called (seen below). What is it and why did it do this? I was able to work in back in place with a pair of pliers? Is this common?







What it should look like after I fixed it.


This gun is sooo finiky and it belongs in the Smithsonian.

Now that the gun is "fixed" and the bolt is not frozen, I attempted to dry fire and I don't hear that "click". I don't have time to drive to range until next weekend and I'm not sure if the gun will fire or not? I'm considering calling Kahr tomorrow regarding these problems. If anyone else owns one of these guns and can tell me what I may be doing wrong or what is happening I'd greatly appreciate it.

Thank you.

[jarrodm]

chances are you arent doing anything wrong. these things are pieces of crap! plain and simple. i owned one a couple years ago. heres the story:

i purchased an M1 thompson for about $1000 through a dealer. when i got it, i opened the box and there were lots of wear marks on the outside of the barrel and on the receiver. naturally i was a little upset as i think $1000 should buy you much better than what i got. i had it sent back to Kahr arms where, THEY LOST IT!!!!! after about 4 -5 months they replaced it with a deluxe 1927 model and fitted case. i too used the 30 round stick mag. loaded the first round and it fired, second round jammed. i eventually got to fire about 10 rounds through that piece of junk but they didnt feed from the mag very well. i gave up on it and tried to sell it off later. i struggled to get $600 for it at a local gun show. it was the first and last firearm i will ever buy from Kahr arms/auto ordnance. customer service is lacking, every time i called i spoke to someone new and no one knew what they hell they were talking about. i lost lots of money on that junker. good luck if you get any kind of service from them!

[dlclarkii]

Thank you I bought it for the nastogila and thought my problems were due to 90 year old design. I read the Kahr bought Auto Ordiance in 1999. The instructions that came with the gun were useless IMHO. Even more worthless is the drum, if I ever get this gun fired agian I'll just use the sticks.

[P89]

I used to own a original Auto Ordance 1927A1, but sold it to get the wife her rock. If you want a manual and an extra straight mag PM me, I'll send it to you. They are crap...nothing more than a novelty item. See how fast the novelty wears off. If you want one to be happy with pony up and get the real deal...still will be a novelty item though.

Check the chamber, mine used to split brass in half and leave the top portion lodged in the throat.

[Gun Bowanna]

dlclarkii,

Your Extractor is Broken!!
That's why your bolt isn't operating properly.
That hooky thing is supposed to be up against the bolt face to pull the fired caseing out of the chamber.

[dlclarkii]

Thanks for the replies. I did get the Thompson as a novelty item. If I knew I was going to have these kind of problems, I would have spent $1300 on a limited slip for my street rod instead

[panther76]

dlclarkii,

Your Extractor is Broken!!
That's why your bolt isn't operating properly.
That hooky thing is supposed to be up against the bolt face to pull the fired caseing out of the chamber.

+1

My buddy bought one and the same thing happened. It sheared off in firing halfway through a stick magazine. Half of it went flying and landed in the mud and the bolt got stuck. Kahr was actually pretty good about handling it according to my buddy, but I wouldn't buy one, not even as a novelty.

[wizzegun]

My Dad has one of these things. It's also a POS. Had the same issue with rounds getting stuck in the chamber and it's a bitch to cycle by hand. I talked to a dealer who had a few of these for sale and he admitted that chamber issues (too tight) are fairly common. It's the luck of the draw. Last year a local dealer had a used one for sale and thought I'd check it out. It was built in the early 80's and seemed to be a nicer quality. He let me fire a few rounds to test it. It ran great and put the brass in a nice little pile. Out of habit, I checked the primers as I picked up the brass. The primers were smashed square. I never saw anything like it. So I pulled the bolt back to expose the firing pin. The end of the pin was gone and the pin body was doing the striking! The firing pin was too long. Out of curiousity, we researched a new firing pin and there are several different lengths depending on the model. So its seems you fix one problem to find another? To me these are wall hangars.

[nfafan]

Yep, own one and it indeed took some effort to tune, but it runs great now. Ran fine on Blazer aluminum case .45 and brass PMC, unknown FMJ reloads, even ran a mag of RNL reloads thru it.

Makes a great looking wallhanger too!

Anyway, as others stated - your extractor is broke - likely not the extracter itself as it's hardened spring steel - but more likely the channel in the bolt it rides in, in the side of the bolt. Some bolts were hardened steel, some were not.

You really need to add the aftermarket EZ-Pull spring set - 2 recoil springs, hammer spring and new hammer; makes the 1927A1 a lot friendlier to use.

Getting drums to work right is an art, and as you discovered, the drums are totally impractical unless you have an FA gun and want to impress friends, but kewl every once an awhile.

Go here for a lot of good drum (and stick mag) info; (EDIT: Been awhile since I did a drum; IIRC, the actual "click" is a full 1/4 turn of the winder, not simply the mechanical noises you hear, you want about 9-10 1/4 turns. Do this and desk-check it with a pencil erasor to shove the rounds out - it should work.)

http://www.notpurfect.com/main/thompson.html#stick


Next; Go here for basic TSMG and semi info:

http://www.machinegunboards.com/foru...hp?showforum=3

Frank I.'s TSMG forum, and tons of us there own the semi versions.

These guys know everything TSMG including a lot of tuning tricks for the semi's...
(Like getting stick mags to work flawlessly - as AOC/Kahr had to tinker with the mag-catch design to make BATF happy.)

These guns are not for the faint-hearted as probably 30% have issues OOTB, while others are near perfect. For what you paid, don't give up on this gun yet; Kahr did fine by me for warranty support - and I own an original pre-Kahr AOC gun that they could have rightfully declined to fix.

Now if you really want the gun to run like a mofo, there are a number of Tommy-smiths that hang at the TSMG forum I linked above - not only can they make your semi sing, they can make it look as close to a non-SBR "1921AC" as your'e willing to pay.

Good luck, now get over and sign-up at the TSMG board!

[GeorgeF]

Sorry, I cannot speak for the semi-auto Thompson. I have a 1921 that works just fine.

That being said, I do use a modern 50 rd drum that works perfectly. I wind it 10 clicks and it goes through all 50 rounds with no hiccup.

Not sure what could cause that malfunction, but main reasons for drums not being used in WW2 were:

- difficulty of carrying
- cost to manufacture
- difficulty in reloading without getting any dirt or mud in the mechanism
- weight of drum

If I was forced to use a drum fed SMG, it would be the Suomi or the PPSH41 - overall weight is far less than the 50rds of .45. Not as much fun mind you ....