State/local law on discharging a firearm?

[tl_3237]

Except ordinances don`t fall under the penal code or motor vehicle code.

Penal statutes and MV statutes are state level. Ordinances are local level LAWS and, as such, are enforceable by PSP. In particular the discharge law for Collegeville posted above is a summary offense and the PSP, as responders, are charged with upholding that local LAW. If, as you intimate, ordinances are not enforceable by the responders (PSP) then how else are they enforceable?

Various local entities are empowered by the state legistalure to establish local ordinances and enforce same under Title 53 P.S. and Pa. C.S.A.

[Exbiker]

Penal statutes and MV statutes are state level. Ordinances are local level LAWS and, as such, are enforceable by PSP. In particular the discharge law for Collegeville posted above is a summary offense and the PSP, as responders, are charged with upolding that local LAW. If, as you say, ordinances are not enforceable by the responders (PSP) then how else are they enforceable?

Various local entities are empowered by the state legistalure to establish local ordinances and enforce same under Title 53 P.S. and Pa. C.S.A.

In my township if somebody violates an ordinance a code enforcement officer, zoning officer, or another department would respond. Most ordinances are civil matters. Discharge of a firearm as long as it didn`t violate a state or federal law would be a matter of ordinance. Either zoning or nuisance.

[bort]

Heard from the Police!

1) No offense taken from any post, I respect all opinions. I also realize your only getting one side of the story.

2) Police said they took the matter seriously. Because there was no immediate/near future threat they could look at all angles to make a decission on action. They involved someone else on the matter and said they have decided on criminal action only, summary unlikely. If criminal action doesn't come to light for me to keep in mind word of mouth about the incident will be a serous deterent from it happening again anywhere here.

3) I mentioned town action and they said I could bring it up and they could look into the matter.

Something is being done, if its left alone on their part I will leave it alone. They have a point about the deterent issue after the incident. I'm sure if a similar incident takes place in the future it will be dealt with.

[Glocker]

I live in a Townhome community and PSP is our responder. The guys next door were firing a handgun/rifle outside our home (about 10 ft. away and were drinking)
I contacted PSP who came out and said I will talk to'em about it, he chalked it up to they just made a mistake (after talking to'em). I didn't approve becuase they showed a serious lack of judgement. 5 children live in direct vicinity (within 20 feet of where it was all fired from) I asked the TPR what my options were because I wasn't happy with the decission and wanted to persue something if I could. He semi-changed his mind and asked me to hold off for a day and he will look into the matter.

1) I can't find a State Law online that was violated, Was one violated?

2) I know there is Town Ordinance on this but I here PSP can't enforce that, true?

This matter is about common sense and saftey only. I will wait to hear from the PSP before I call anyone to see what I can push but is there anything I can push if need be? Thanks for any input!

Wow.....being a Townhouse owner myself I would also be concerned.

Although more information to this situation would be helpful, I believe the information provided is enough to spark concern.

I also live in the Collegeville area in a Town-home. I do not know of any Town-homes in the Collegeville area with appropriate gunfire back drops, nor do I believe firing a gun outside of a Town-home would be a practice done in good judgment.

Regardless of any ordinance, etc..........these gentleman were engaging in a practice that makes it more difficult for responsible gun owners. Were these gentleman shooting in the air?What goes up must come down (whether that be on your head, your car, your dog, etc.).......... Were these gentleman shooting into the ground?Bullet could ricochet and hit something not intended to hit...............Was there an appropriate back drop where these gentleman were shooting? Neighborhood dog, child could have accidentally been injured/killed if not.

I don't know of any Town-homes in the Collegeville area that would be appropriate substitutes for a gun range.

I agree poor judgment was used regardless of ordinance, etc. If they were my neighbors I would personally talk to them regarding their actions (if they were receptive to discussion). Regardless as to whether or not they were receptive to discussion, I would ensure their irresponsible actions did not occur in the vicinity of my house/family in the future.

Best of Luck with your situation!!!!!!!......Be safe.

[unclejumbo]

Let me preface my response by saying that I am not privy to any information other than what has been posted here. I am a State Trooper. We DO NOT enforce ordinances. Laws enacted by the Commonwealth of PA are what we enforce. Ordinance enforcement is the job of local police, codes enforcement etc. It would be too difficult trying to keep track of local ordinances. Every local government enacts their own and where I work, we have at least ten different local governments we would have to deal with. As far as the shooting of firearms where not appropriate. As with anything, it is the totality of the circumstances. Did they shoot from an elevated deck into the ground? Was anyone in the vicinity (in danger) of where the shooting occurred? Did they fire off a hundred rounds or one? Was it a 50 BMG or a 22? For me, if it is not a clear cut violation of the law and no immediate action is needed, I will run it by the DA for guidance. Could be recklessly endangering, could be disorderly conduct, may be nothing. There is no state statute that defines where you can and can't shoot other than safety zone under game laws. That only applies while hunting.

[Pa. Patriot]

Let me preface my response by saying that I am not privy to any information other than what has been posted here. I am a State Trooper. We DO NOT enforce ordinances. Laws enacted by the Commonwealth of PA are what we enforce. Ordinance enforcement is the job of local police, codes enforcement etc. It would be too difficult trying to keep track of local ordinances. Every local government enacts their own and where I work, we have at least ten different local governments we would have to deal with. As far as the shooting of firearms where not appropriate. As with anything, it is the totality of the circumstances. Did they shoot from an elevated deck into the ground? Was anyone in the vicinity (in danger) of where the shooting occurred? Did they fire off a hundred rounds or one? Was it a 50 BMG or a 22? For me, if it is not a clear cut violation of the law and no immediate action is needed, I will run it by the DA for guidance. Could be recklessly endangering, could be disorderly conduct, may be nothing. There is no state statute that defines where you can and can't shoot other than safety zone under game laws. That only applies while hunting.

Thanks for the input.

[chrisjames_71]

Let me preface my response by saying that I am not privy to any information other than what has been posted here. I am a State Trooper. We DO NOT enforce ordinances. Laws enacted by the Commonwealth of PA are what we enforce. Ordinance enforcement is the job of local police, codes enforcement etc. It would be too difficult trying to keep track of local ordinances. Every local government enacts their own and where I work, we have at least ten different local governments we would have to deal with. As far as the shooting of firearms where not appropriate. As with anything, it is the totality of the circumstances. Did they shoot from an elevated deck into the ground? Was anyone in the vicinity (in danger) of where the shooting occurred? Did they fire off a hundred rounds or one? Was it a 50 BMG or a 22? For me, if it is not a clear cut violation of the law and no immediate action is needed, I will run it by the DA for guidance. Could be recklessly endangering, could be disorderly conduct, may be nothing. There is no state statute that defines where you can and can't shoot other than safety zone under game laws. That only applies while hunting.

Very well put and welcome aboard!!

[gnbrotz]

As with anything, it is the totality of the circumstances. Did they shoot from an elevated deck into the ground? Was anyone in the vicinity (in danger) of where the shooting occurred? Did they fire off a hundred rounds or one? Was it a 50 BMG or a 22?

Could you explain a little further? Assuming a proper backstop and absence of persons in the 'danger zone', how is round count or caliber relevant?

[Poonie]

I have found the PSP to be of little help in situations where they were called. I had an incident several months ago where some punks drove down our street and sprayed the houses with bbgun fire from a car, then took off. I was working in my garage at the time and a bb came in and bounced around before coming to rest on the floor. I ran out, got a description of ther car and then called the troopers(our town is also under PSP patrol). A trooper was sent out, and took my story. A neighbor heard the call on her scanner and came to my house while the officer was there, and told him that her mother was at the local supermarket and saw a car that fit the description from the police call and called her daughter who then came to our house. The trooper left and I never heard from him again. His lackluster reactions simply told me that to them this is a non-issue, not worthy of their time. As a taxpayer, I found this action from a public servant to be less than satisfactory.

My next door neighbor had her porch light shot out twice by probably these same kids. She called the PSP and they basically told her without proof there was not much they could do. Maybe so, but even a patrol down our street once in a blue moon would be better than nothing. I have yet to see them down our street since, and at this point have lost all confidence in the PSP.

[bort]

I don't believe we can knock the PSP since it was well explained. They have guidlines to follow and they will follow them. He/she explained to me exactly what they were saying before. Again, thank you Trooper.

My issue was settled with the individuals. They apoligized, and stated it was a very stupid thing to do. They even aknowledged serious saftey concerns. They even mentioned they would understand if I made an issue about it. They are willing to go to firearms saftey course (with-in 2 months) if I provide them the info and let it go. I agreed. That was their idea so they are owning up to the mistake.

Thanks for all the info everyone.