$200 for a 1945 Mosin-Nagant M44?

[WVneighbor]

Thank you all.

I am appreciative for the gift, it was thoughtful and I'm happy to have it. The main reason I'm trying to get an idea if she overpaid is to decide if I am going to continue doing business with this particular establishment. If, as I believe is the case, she was grossly overcharged, I'm going to take my business elsewhere.

Pics are coming, I'm waiting for the damn battery to charge.

[nijwnfi]

Next range trip, try shooting it with the bayonet extended. That's how they were sighted. No BS, I'm not messing with you. It may shoot high. If so, a quick cheap fix is take a piece of flat electric wire (romex), and split it open. Take the black wire, and strip a piece of the black insulation off the wire. Stick it over the sight post, cut to size. More times than not, these rifles shoot high.

[kiladonut]

I wouldnt do business with anyone that trys to sell mosin nagant m44s for $200. Even if it is excellent condition that is way too much. If it was a tula then maybe, but even still. You should be able to pick those rifles up for ~$100 in excellent condition and its possible to find them for sub $60 if you do some digging. Heck the gander mountain by my house sells them for $99. They are cool rifles though and I love mine. nijwnfi is right about shooting with the bayonet extended too, thats how they are meant to be shot. I would say enjoy the gift and think twice before buying from that retailer again or just do some homework before you buy anything from them. PS. I paid $150 for mine before i really knew anything about them, but even over paying for these rifles is worth it IMO

[mak47]

It was alluded to before, and is correct. Right now, $200 is a bit much for an M44. That being said, I have seen them in several shops for around that price, so it isn't unheard of. In a year or two when the supply starts to dry up more you'll be able to joke about how your wife paid "so little" for the gun!

These guns have a lot of history behind them and are definitely worth owning. They were built to last, and designed to be operated by soldiers with little to know training who were in many cases not expected to carry the rifle for more than a few minutes before being killed in battle. That being said, in WWII the Russian army had far more troops on the field than they had rifles, so most of them were carried to the front line and simply picked up by one soldier after another until the battle was either won or lost.

Now, as far as shooting goes, most of these are fantastic guns. They are accurate and unbelievably fun to shoot. Try to wait til dusk so you can really see the gigantic fireball that shoots out of the muzzle when it's fired.

Most of these guns have been counterbored, if it has, the crown will be silver in color instead of blued like the rest of the gun. Some say that this has an adverse effect on accuracy, and it will cause the gun to fail the "bullet test", but mine has been counterbored and shoots quite accurately.
This was done because there was excessive wear on the crowns and the arsenals would simply grind down the barrels to get back to good rifling and improve accuracy.

If yours isn't counterbored, then it probably was never shot much. Which is a good thing, but I wouldn't worry too much if yours has.

These rifles do kick HARD. They were designed for soldiers who were wearing many layers of clothing, who wouldn't be affected greatly by the recoil--not American civilians out for a day at the range. You can get a nice padded replacement butt-pad on Ebay for about $20 that will help a great deal. This will help with accuracy because you won't instinctively move the rifle to a "less bruised" part of your shoulder between shots.

Here's one last thing to bear in mind when shooting and selecting ammo. The heavier the bullet, the bigger the boom and the harder the kick. Lots of the Brown/Silver Bear stuff is really heavy 203 grain ammunition--that's not what the military specs called for. It works, but in many cases not as well as the cheaper military surplus ammo that's floating around.

There are two types you will find, and for the M44 I like the lighter stuff better. Light ball - @ 147 grs & Heavy ball - 180+grs. Since this gun is really just a shortened version of it's predecessor, the power of the ammunition has to come into play. Heavy ball ammo, which works fine in the longer, heavier 91/30 throws around a bit more power than is comfortable for the carbine version. Again, it works, but if you're trying to shoot for accuracy at 100+ yards, the last thing you want to do is add unnecessary recoil to your shots.

Be careful shooting the milsurp stuff, cuz it's all corrosive, but it works just fine and saves you a TON of cash. Just make sure you clean the gun promptly after shooting--they are easy enough to clean right at the range, which is nice. Spray some Ammonia or windex down the barrel to counteract the corrosive chemicals, swab it out, then clean as normal and you should have nothing to worry about.

And yes...they are designed to be shot with the bayonet extended. At 25 or 50 yards it probably doesn't make a dime's worth of difference, but at 100+ it could throw you off if it's closed.

Have fun with it! Even if she did pay a bit too much, it's yours now so you might as well enjoy it. They are nice guns, they work for hunting if you so desire, and the stocks can be refinished to look absolutely beautiful.

A gun that goes bang every time you pull the trigger, and hits what you're pointing it at is worth $200. You'll make the money back on Ammo when you consider the cost difference between 7.62x54r milsurp and the comparable
.30-06.

Take it out and play with it, I bet it becomes one of your favorite rifles.

[Poonie]

Regardless of whether in two years she'll be able to joke about paying $200.00, the fact is she paid $200.00 now for a gun that NOW is only worth about $120.00 max....Yes IMO she got taken. The rifle you describe is not anything spectacular from a collector standpoint. It sounds like a run of the mill mismatched rifle. Nothing wrong with the gun however, its just that she got ripped off. Now if me, I wouldn't go near the store that sold that gun to her for that price. Obviously an unscrupulous dealer who cast a line and reeled in a big one. Hey it happens to us all at one time or another(I should know, I have been there myself) hopes this is a lesson to you all to do oyur homework first next time.

[Poonie]

And yes...they are designed to be shot with the bayonet extended. At 25 or 50 yards it probably doesn't make a dime's worth of difference, but at 100+ it could throw you off if it's closed.

.

Yes, but you can drift the front sight to compensate. I never shoot mine with the bayonet open, and simply adjusted the front sight.

[WVneighbor]

Here are the pics:

Overview:



Butt stock:



Mid-section:



Front end w/bayonet extended:



Close up of the mid-section:



Crown:



Importer Marks:



Grip area, here you can see what I referred to as "dirty", it looks like the sweat and grime of decades:



Overall I'm happy with the rifle. I like the fact it was made during the war years and COULD have seen action, that it could have been in Berlin, that it does have a history. I like the way it feels and shoots (the recoil isnt THAT bad!). I tried shooting it with the bayonet extended and didn't have any better luck hitting a target. I'm going to take a 2ftx2ft piece of cardboard with me to the range next time and see if I can get it to group at all before I start moving or modifying the sights. I have high hopes because the rifling is so very plainly visible and the crown appears to be in good shape. It would seem to me that if the rifling wasn't so plain and visible and if the crown were messed up, it would cause more worries as far as accuracy go.

If I can't get it to group relatively well I may look into re-barreling it. The action seems (to my admittedly untrained eye) to be in good shape, I'm just concerned the barrel might be a dud. More trips to the range are in order to find out.

I'm going to go to the pawn shop where she bought it and see if they will either give a partial refund or throw in $60 worth of ammo. Its unlikely either will happen, but the worst they can tell me is to get the hell out. I wanted the gun to shoot, not to collect or to be able to say "Hey look what I got". I have a couple others on "THE LIST" which are of 1940-1960 vintage and all I'm really looking for are shooters, they don't have to be in pristine condition, I plan on taking them out and using them for what they were intended to do .... blow watermelons apart.

Once again I want to thank you guys. This place has a great group of people with a wealth of information.

[Saintvictor]

I take the pressure of buying me a firearm for Christmas off my wife and go to the ginshop early, pick one out, and lay it away. Or at least pick one out as a suggestion of a good gift choice.

[wizzegun]

On the up side, from the pics the M44 looks like it has the original finish and the tiny import mark shows that it is an older import. The mismatched bolt was most likely done at an armory so this rifle probably saw some service and has a history.

It is a shame that your wife was not treated fairly. I would have to say something to owner of the store if it's a place you often do business. If he cares about your business, he should make it right.

I am sure everyone here can relate a story of paying too much/not knowing enough. Its sort of a rite of passage. My 1st milsurp was a russian captured K98 that I overpaid about $100. It was at a show and I wanted it. Now I know better and always skim over that dealer's overpriced table. Arm yourself with knowledge and you will eventually score a deal. Actually it will turn into many deals and the next thing you know you have a collection.

[Suburban]

Thank you all.

I am appreciative for the gift, it was thoughtful and I'm happy to have it. The main reason I'm trying to get an idea if she overpaid is to decide if I am going to continue doing business with this particular establishment. If, as I believe is the case, she was grossly overcharged, I'm going to take my business elsewhere.

Pics are coming, I'm waiting for the damn battery to charge.

I paid $95 when I bought one for my dad in 2002. I haven't been looking at prices since then though.


He was getting pretty bad accuracy with the heavier bullets. Seems that this is pretty common, as the recoil is pushing the rifle off target before the bullet gets out of the barrel. The lighter bullets, 147grain if memory serves, shot much better groups.