Can I throw a gun away?

**39flathead** · November 21st, 2008, 10:08 PM

Originally Posted by ReefBlue

People always say, tounge-in-cheek, that they had a boat accident and don't have their guns.

What if I said I threw my gun in the garbage and don't have it anymore? Is that illegal?

I would say:
I sold them to a guy at the last gunshow. Sorry, didn't get his name. He paid me in cash.

**Poonie** · November 22nd, 2008, 12:46 PM

I think this thread was meant to ask whether using "I threw it away" would get him out of trouble if someone came looking for your weapons, say in a confiscation scenario. Problem is, the guy posted his intentions here for the whole world to see so now everybody knows that line is a fluke. Who knows who is watching here. Best is to do what you have to do and keep it zipped.

**eells** · November 23rd, 2008, 08:58 PM

melt it. ah, i guess theyd get you with destroying the serial number or something like that

**CommonHighrise** · November 24th, 2008, 12:01 AM

Fill 5 gal bucket 1/2 with concrete, drop in frame, full rest of way. Allow to set, and put aside. When gun collector comes to Obaminate your wares, hand him the bucket of dried concrete, and assure him the gun is in there.

**Xringshooter** · November 24th, 2008, 04:09 PM

I have sent an email to the BATFE asking this question "How does one legally dispose of a gun when it cannot be repaired." I then stated the "cut it up and toss in trash, etc. scenarios. I received (today) a reply stating that my email has been forwarded to the appropriate section to be answered. I am waiting to see what they say. I will post as soon as I get an answer, no matter what the answer says.

**knight0334** · November 24th, 2008, 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by GunLawyer001

Throwing a gun in the trash is an unlawful transfer to the trash collection agency.

Claiming to have thrown a gun away may come back to bite you if you make that claim to a LEO, then it's later found in your attic.

I wanna debate that a bit..

With that logic, then handing a packaged gun to a Fedex driver to deliver is an unlawful transfer too.

Many of the garbage disposal sites are municipal owned, that would make the garbage truck/driver/company just a carrier like a Fedex/UPS driver would be. The receiving party would be the people as a whole, partly yourself as being part of the people.

**General Geoff** · November 24th, 2008, 04:25 PM

If you cut/torch the frame or receiver into two or more pieces, it would be nothing more than junk and should legally considered benign trash. Might get a few cents for it if you took it to a metal scrap yard.

**GunLawyer001** · November 24th, 2008, 04:55 PM

Originally Posted by knight0334

I wanna debate that a bit..

With that logic, then handing a packaged gun to a Fedex driver to deliver is an unlawful transfer too.

Many of the garbage disposal sites are municipal owned, that would make the garbage truck/driver/company just a carrier like a Fedex/UPS driver would be. The receiving party would be the people as a whole, partly yourself as being part of the people.

My advice is intended to alert the users here to the worst case that the DA or ATF could make. In this case, it's not too far-fetched to say that handing a gun to a trash collector is a transfer.

The difference between the trash hauler and UPS is that UPS is a common carrier, and they don't take title to the packages that they take from place to place. Your trash hauler owns what he picks up, until he finds a landfill to take title to it.

Placing the gun in the trash can, knowing that eventually it will be picked up and taken away, is conceptually similar to placing a gun in a random mailbox in front of a random home. You're abandoning it and leaving it in the car of an identifiable person, whether it's the home owner or a trash hauling corporation.

**knight0334** · November 24th, 2008, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by GunLawyer001

My advice is intended to alert the users here to the worst case that the DA or ATF could make. In this case, it's not too far-fetched to say that handing a gun to a trash collector is a transfer.

The difference between the trash hauler and UPS is that UPS is a common carrier, and they don't take title to the packages that they take from place to place. Your trash hauler owns what he picks up, until he finds a landfill to take title to it.

Placing the gun in the trash can, knowing that eventually it will be picked up and taken away, is conceptually similar to placing a gun in a random mailbox in front of a random home. You're abandoning it and leaving it in the car of an identifiable person, whether it's the home owner or a trash hauling corporation.

okay...

I know I'm splitting hairs with this, but what about delivery to the dump yourself, a municipal dump. No middle man to take title.

The law says, "Any person who is not a licensed importer, manufacturer or dealer and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm to another unlicensed person shall do so only upon the place of business of a licensed importer, manufacturer, dealer or county sheriff's office, the latter of whom shall follow the procedure set forth in this section as if he were the seller of the firearm." Person being the key word. In a public dump so long as you dump it yourself, it wouldn't be sold or transferred to another unlicensed person. A technical defense perhaps?? It would be abandoned property, but who is going to find it in the modern dumps that the EPA requires to be covered by X number inches of soil/clay each day.

Dont get me wrong, I'm not try to avoid doing lawful transfers or lawful destruction of a receiver. But without some dumbass admitting to putting it in collection type pickup to nail him for an unlawful transfer would be like trying to prove who farted at a sewage treatment plant.

**GunLawyer001** · November 24th, 2008, 07:11 PM

Originally Posted by knight0334

okay...

I know I'm splitting hairs with this, but what about delivery to the dump yourself, a municipal dump. No middle man to take title.

The law says, "Any person who is not a licensed importer, manufacturer or dealer and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm to another unlicensed person shall do so only upon the place of business of a licensed importer, manufacturer, dealer or county sheriff's office, the latter of whom shall follow the procedure set forth in this section as if he were the seller of the firearm." Person being the key word. In a public dump so long as you dump it yourself, it wouldn't be sold or transferred to another unlicensed person. A technical defense perhaps?? It would be abandoned property, but who is going to find it in the modern dumps that the EPA requires to be covered by X number inches of soil/clay each day.

Dont get me wrong, I'm not try to avoid doing lawful transfers or lawful destruction of a receiver. But without some dumbass admitting to putting it in collection type pickup to nail him for an unlawful transfer would be like trying to prove who farted at a sewage treatment plant.

The law is all about "splitting hairs".

"Person" is a term of art. Humans are "natural persons", while corps and LLC's and even the dreaded trusts are "legal persons". Some "person" owns that land.

Burying it yourself at the dump will probably never be an issue. But technically, you are conveying it into the unwitting custody of whoever owns or operates the landfill. I can't imagine it ever seeing a courtroom, unless someone finds the thing before it rusts, and uses it in a crime, and the cops need someone to sacrifice to the media gods. Slim odds.

I believe that some degree of sorting goes on at landfills, or at least it should. The EPA and the Superfund laws are harsh, nobody wants to bury a bunch of toxic waste; plus, a smart operator would pull recyclable metals out and resell them. So maybe that gun would be found before burial.

But the OP's question was if it would be legal to throw it in the trash, and the answer is still "not really, not completely".