PICS denial

[Ronnie857]

Hi everyone. This is my first post and I am a new member here. last Saturday i won a pistol via raffle. I was denied. Even with my SSN on the 4473. Heres the thing though. I have successfully purchased and transferred a dozen or so firearms in in the past 7 years with most recent being Aug 1st. I have a LTCF. There is nothing on my ciminal record tha prevents me from my 2nd amendment right in the state of Pennsylvania. I have had a traffic ticket in the past few months. I forgot to renew my registration. My court date for that is March 3rd. Also i am a Jr. With my father not being allowed a firearm because of his dodgy past. How long does an appeal like this take? I submitted the SP4-197 via mail today.

[steve_010]

Let me guess. You live in Philly.

I suggest contacting a lawyer that specializes in this.

[Ronnie857]

Let me guess. You live in Philly.
I suggest contacting a lawyer that specializes in this.

I reside in delco. I have contacted two lawyers but havent received a response as of yet. The ffl didnt even receive a transaction number. They just kicked the call. So i dont have that number

[Royinmontco]

I reside in delco. I have contacted two lawyers but havent received a response as of yet. The ffl didnt even receive a transaction number. They just kicked the call. So i dont have that number

Are you sure you were really denied by pics? Could it be a shady FFL that doesnt want to lose a pistol to a raffle winner?

[Xringshooter]

Are you sure you were really denied by pics? Could it be a shady FFL that doesnt want to lose a pistol to a raffle winner?

That pistol should have already been contracted to be paid for by the people putting on the raffle, so the FFL's not losing anything. Also check the raffle, most have something in case a person does get denied (cash equivalent, substitute prize, etc.)

I hope you gave as much information on the challenge form about the differences between you and your dad, the more info you can provide them the better. If it comes back overturned (approved) they may also provide you with a UPIN (Unique Personal Identification Number) that you will use in any future firearms purchases. If they do not give you one, I would suggest asking for it (since it happened once, it can happen again).

If it comes back upheld (denied) they may (should) tell you how to provide any other information that will be relevant to your case. If they don't, then it would probably be time to hire a lawyer who is versed in PA firearms laws. I think that if you gave them good info on the challenge form, it should come back approved.

[HKusp 45]

I reside in delco. I have contacted two lawyers but havent received a response as of yet. The ffl didnt even receive a transaction number. They just kicked the call. So i dont have that number

Phil Kline AKA gunlawyer

(215) 538-4444

FYI it is very possible they still flagged you because of your name if you are 100% positive you are good to go file a pics challenge asap you only have 30 days from the date of the denial to do so . The gun shop should have also discussed the denial and the challenge form with you as well if they did not then it sounds like something is not right. I'm not saying it is or isn't but seems strange to me. Gun shop won't know why your denied they just know you are.

here's the relevant information for the pics denial

https://www.psp.pa.gov/firearms-info...em---PICS.aspx

[Ronnie857]

Are you sure you were really denied by pics? Could it be a shady FFL that doesnt want to lose a pistol to a raffle winner?

If thats the case i will find out either way. I highly doubt it though lol. He is a reputable guy. The ffl is is his side buisness with his full time gig being an LEO.

[Ronnie857]

That pistol should have already been contracted to be paid for by the people putting on the raffle, so the FFL's not losing anything. Also check the raffle, most have something in case a person does get denied (cash equivalent, substitute prize, etc.)

I hope you gave as much information on the challenge form about the differences between you and your dad, the more info you can provide them the better. If it comes back overturned (approved) they may also provide you with a UPIN (Unique Personal Identification Number) that you will use in any future firearms purchases. If they do not give you one, I would suggest asking for it (since it happened once, it can happen again).

If it comes back upheld (denied) they may (should) tell you how to provide any other information that will be relevant to your case. If they don't, then it would probably be time to hire a lawyer who is versed in PA firearms laws. I think that if you gave them good info on the challenge form, it should come back approved.

The challenge form is the exact info the 4473 asked. The raffle was actually held by the ffl himself. He said if it didnt clear he would cash me out on the firearm.

[Xringshooter]

The challenge form is the exact info the 4473 asked. The raffle was actually held by the ffl himself. He said if it didnt clear he would cash me out on the firearm.

Yes, it does ask basically the same questions as the 4473 but the when doing the PICS check it uses your DL info and doesn't necessarily take into account the info you can provide on the challenge form. Remember the PICS people don't see how you answered/filled in the questions/blocks, they just respond to what the computer tells them. That's why if your are Jr. and the computer doesn't see it, it can be a red flag causing the denial. When the PSP does the investigation using the info from the challenge form, they go even more in depth than the PICS does.

The other thing that I noticed is that you said the FFL did the raffle himself. Does the FFL also have a PA Small Games of Chance License? If he does not he legally can not hold a raffle, doesn't matter if he is a LEO or not. Raffles are used to generate funds, typically for non profit organizations, volunteer fire departments, veterans organizations, etc. NOT for businesses. Even the Friends of NRA (FoNRA) committees have to obtain a small games of chance license when they hold their fund raising banquets and raffle off guns. Him doing this without the license doesn't affect you but it can burn him.

[Ronnie857]

Phil Kline AKA gunlawyer

(215) 538-4444

FYI it is very possible they still flagged you because of your name if you are 100% positive you are good to go file a pics challenge asap you only have 30 days from the date of the denial to do so . The gun shop should have also discussed the denial and the challenge form with you as well if they did not then it sounds like something is not right. I'm not saying it is or isn't but seems strange to me. Gun shop won't know why your denied they just know you are.

here's the relevant information for the pics denial

https://www.psp.pa.gov/firearms-info...em---PICS.aspx

The ffl did provide the SP4-197 challenge form. I sent that off this morning. I also shot Phil and left a message for him just to get his opinion and cover all of my bases