Illegal reference check?

[streaker69]

Until he was enjoined https://blog.princelaw.com/2018/01/1...-requirements/

Question about that. Is it the sheriff's office that's enjoined, or the elected sheriff himself? Does all that apply to a new sheriff when elected?

[SevenMilePete]

The law requires a standard form provided by PSP. That form includes references, however some counties cross that part out.

I believe the form is front/back, so if they used a 1 sided printer, it would be two pages. If my memory is incorrect someone will swiftly correct this post.

I just downloaded Erie County form. No references on it.
https://www.eriecountypa.gov/media/6...rie-co-ltc.pdf

[gnbrotz]

Question about that. Is it the sheriff's office that's enjoined, or the elected sheriff himself? Does all that apply to a new sheriff when elected?

My guess is that it applies to the "position" and whomever is filling the office as time goes on.

When my LTCF was revoked, my appeal challenged, by name, the guy who was in office, who actually issued the revocation letter (in November).

He was actually retiring, and when my hearing came around in January, the new sheriff, not named in my filing, had to show up in court. It was his third day in office. The retired sheriff was nowhere around. Local media had to go to his home to ask for a statement.

[556FMJ]

I just downloaded Erie County form. No references on it.
https://www.eriecountypa.gov/media/6...rie-co-ltc.pdf

That's great to see that. They just completely removed that section altogether. Awesome.

[gnbrotz]

That's great to see that. They just completely removed that section altogether. Awesome.

That's a bold move for a Sheriff, given that by law, the PSP are given the responsibility/authority to promulgate the form.

Exceeding one's authority is just as bad when the result is "favorable" for gun owners as it is any other time. They can abstain from checking references without crossing the line and changing a form that they have no legal authority to alter.

[SevenMilePete]

That's a bold move for a Sheriff, given that by law, the PSP are given the responsibility/authority to promulgate the form.

Exceeding one's authority is just as bad when the result is "favorable" for gun owners as it is any other time. They can abstain from checking references without crossing the line and changing a form that they have no legal authority to alter.

Which law is that? If you look at the PSP website, there are no forms for LTCF. Perhaps Erie County is the only one using the correct form.

[tl_3237]

I just downloaded Erie County form. No references on it.
https://www.eriecountypa.gov/media/6...rie-co-ltc.pdf

Which law is that? If you look at the PSP website, there are no forms for LTCF. Perhaps Erie County is the only one using the correct form.

gnbrotz is correct that the Erie form is an altered SP4-127 (10-2012) form in that it eliminated §29 regarding references. In checking 5 other counties at random, they all are still using the SP4-127 (10-2012) which includes the reference section unaltered.

Example:
Chester - https://chesco.org/DocumentCenter/View/25989
Berks - http://www.co.berks.pa.us/Dept/Sheri...pplication.pdf
Lancaster - https://co.lancaster.pa.us/DocumentCenter/View/683


You are correct that the PSP website does not provide a copy of the generic form. I suspect that is because the public source for the form is the sheriff's office of application.

18 Pa CSA §6109(c)
(c) Form of application and content.--The application for a license to carry a firearm shall be uniform throughout this Commonwealth and shall be on a form prescribed by the Pennsylvania State Police. The form may contain provisions, not exceeding one page, to assure compliance with this section. Issuing authorities shall use only the application form prescribed by the Pennsylvania State Police.

[SevenMilePete]

gnbrotz is correct that the Erie form is an altered SP4-127 (10-2012) form in that it eliminated §29 regarding references. In checking 5 other counties at random, they all are still using the SP4-127 (10-2012) which includes the reference section unaltered.

Example:
Chester - https://chesco.org/DocumentCenter/View/25989
Berks - http://www.co.berks.pa.us/Dept/Sheri...pplication.pdf
Lancaster - https://co.lancaster.pa.us/DocumentCenter/View/683


You are correct that the PSP website does not provide a copy of the generic form. I suspect that is because the public source for the form is the sheriff's office of application.

Mea Culpa! I guess the Erie County Sheriff didn't see that either. I hope my renewal is still valid.

[556FMJ]

Update: My friend finally got his LTCF this week. Hopefully Mr. Prince lit a fire under their asses to change their BS.

[556FMJ]

So, less than the 45 days required, but still a heck of a lot longer than the 5 minutes it should have taken. Plus mailing me an illegal form to fill out ....