Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mill Hall, Pennsylvania
    (Clinton County)
    Age
    33
    Posts
    1,551
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    Default LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    Just figured I'd share my experience today in Clinton County. Went in to renew my LTCF today. Walked in and told the security guard I needed to check a firearm and he kind of scoffed a bit and said I "should have left it at home". I told him I take it everywhere. Thankfully, after almost picking up my gun from the tray he let me unload the pistol after I mentioned that I was more familiar with it and it would be safer for me to do it. Didn't have any more issues and we actually struck up conversation about the pistol he likes to carry.

    After going to the window of the new office upstairs that the CC Sheriff's office moved to I spoke with the secretary about the renewal. She handed me the form and instructed me to fill it out including the references. I politely made the case that I didn't need to put any references on my form, that it was an invasion of privacy and infringed my rights, she asked an officer to clarify and I was allowed to leave that section blank.

    In and out in 15 minutes with a shiny new LTCF and I left glad that we have a gun friendly sheriff's office!
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    μολ ν λαβέ
    What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Ross township, Pennsylvania
    (Allegheny County)
    Posts
    1,170
    Rep Power
    14389173

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Gixxer View Post
    I politely made the case that I didn't need to put any references on my form, that it was an invasion of privacy and infringed my rights, she asked an officer to clarify and I was allowed to leave that section blank.
    Believe it or not this is my first time hearing about the right to decline giving references. Have any links that cover the topic?
    http://forum.pafoa.org/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=22341&dateline=139092  6582

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mill Hall, Pennsylvania
    (Clinton County)
    Age
    33
    Posts
    1,551
    Rep Power
    21474848

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    Quote Originally Posted by K.C. View Post
    Believe it or not this is my first time hearing about the right to decline giving references. Have any links that cover the topic?
    Took the following from here...
    https://blog.princelaw.com/2019/10/1...t-information/

    Pursuant to 18 Pa.C.S. 6111(g)(3.1), in pertinent part:

    Any person … who knowingly and intentionally obtains or furnishes information collected or maintained pursuant to section 6109 for any purpose other than compliance with this chapter or who knowingly or intentionally disseminates, publishes or otherwise makes available such information to any person other than the subject of the information commits a felony of the third degree

    Thereafter, 18 Pa.C.S. 6111(i) provides, in pertinent part:

    Confidentiality.–All information provided by the … applicant, including, but not limited to, the … applicant’s name or identity, furnished by … any applicant for a license to carry a firearm as provided by section 6109 shall be confidential and not subject to public disclosure. In addition to any other sanction or penalty imposed by this chapter, any person, … State or local governmental agency or department that violates this subsection shall be liable in civil damages in the amount of $1,000 per occurrence or three times the actual damages incurred as a result of the violation, whichever is greater, as well as reasonable attorney fees
    And also...
    nothing within the licensing statute – 18 Pa.C.S. 6109 – requiring or even mentioning references.
    There is also a lot more out there supporting this that can be found with a few go0gal searches.
    Last edited by Mr_Gixxer; December 9th, 2019 at 07:15 PM.
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    μολ ν λαβέ
    What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms!

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Ross township, Pennsylvania
    (Allegheny County)
    Posts
    1,170
    Rep Power
    14389173

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    ^^^^^

    Great info, Glad I was made aware of these dirty bastards who break the law with ease just because they can get away with it without repercussion.
    http://forum.pafoa.org/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=22341&dateline=139092  6582

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mill Hall, Pennsylvania
    (Clinton County)
    Age
    33
    Posts
    1,551
    Rep Power
    21474848

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    Quote Originally Posted by K.C. View Post
    ^^^^^

    Great info, Glad I was made aware of these dirty bastards who break the law with ease just because they can get away with it without repercussion.
    There's a lot more info regarding this out there, that was all I could come up with quickly, getting ready for my daughters 2nd grade Christmas concert .

    Hopefully others will chime in.
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    μολ ν λαβέ
    What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Corry, Pennsylvania
    (Erie County)
    Age
    61
    Posts
    192
    Rep Power
    679333

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    I just moved back to PA, and downloaded the Erie County form last night. I was surprised to see it doesn't ask for references.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Oakland Mills, Pennsylvania
    (Juniata County)
    Posts
    3,315
    Rep Power
    21367648

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Gixxer View Post
    Just figured I'd share my experience today in Clinton County. Went in to renew my LTCF today. Walked in and told the security guard I needed to check a firearm and he kind of scoffed a bit and said I "should have left it at home". I told him I take it everywhere. Thankfully, after almost picking up my gun from the tray he let me unload the pistol after I mentioned that I was more familiar with it and it would be safer for me to do it. Didn't have any more issues and we actually struck up conversation about the pistol he likes to carry.

    After going to the window of the new office upstairs that the CC Sheriff's office moved to I spoke with the secretary about the renewal. She handed me the form and instructed me to fill it out including the references. I politely made the case that I didn't need to put any references on my form, that it was an invasion of privacy and infringed my rights, she asked an officer to clarify and I was allowed to leave that section blank.

    In and out in 15 minutes with a shiny new LTCF and I left glad that we have a gun friendly sheriff's office!


    Good to know about the speed. Move to Clinton last year and wasn't sure what their process was, so thank you for sharing. Shame they are wasting my tax dollars on a door guard, however.

    Not a chance their handling my firearm, or that I am unloading it. That isn't a requirement of the law, and I'm sure has hell not finger f**king a firearm in a place without a safe direction to point or a clearing barrel, but I ran into that issue in Snyder county when they dumped their perfectly good and new the law security guard and started having deputies at the front door.

    Where are their lockers? Right by the door? or tucked away somewhere? *unable to rep btw*
    "Cives Arma Ferant"

    "I know I'm not James Bond, that's why I don't keep a loaded gun under the pillow, or bang Russian spies on a regular basis." - GunLawyer001

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mill Hall, Pennsylvania
    (Clinton County)
    Age
    33
    Posts
    1,551
    Rep Power
    21474848

    Default Re: LTCF Renewal Experience Today, No References Needed

    Lockers are behind the checkpoint just inside the main hallway. Guard said they are planning on moving them into the lobby area just inside the doors before the checkpoint to make it self serve. I think that was why the guard grumbled a little bit when I told him I wanted to check a firearm. It wasn't that he was anti gun, I just don't think he wanted the hassle at the time.
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    μολ ν λαβέ
    What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms!

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