Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #11
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Gixxer View Post

    Yep, is a repost, because the thread title of the original post isn't readily "searchable:"

    http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.ph...ighlight=judge

    Noah
    There's no place like home for the hollandaise.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    Mohnton, Pennsylvania
    (Berks County)
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by knight0334 View Post
    That ruling isn't going to stand for long. The AR lower has (2) of the three requirements. The hammer and the firing mechanism. The finding that it also house the barrel is optional with the word "usually".

    There is also long standing belief that the lower is the receiver.

    If people keep fucking around with the AR legalities you will end up having both the upper and lower ruled to be controlled receivers.

    Definition:
    That part of a firearm which provides housing for the hammer, bolt or breechblock, and firing mechanism, and which is usually threaded at its forward portion to receive the barrel.

    Proof of my argument is practically any semi-auto handgun. The bolt is the slide and breechblock is also the slide - but the gripframe is the receiver. If they rule that an upper is also a receiver, every slide will become a receiver as well.
    Falls apart on roller locks. FCG is non registered, upper is.
    The Gun is the Badge of a Free Man

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
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    Brookville, Pennsylvania
    (Jefferson County)
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunsnwater View Post
    Falls apart on roller locks. FCG is non registered, upper is.
    Yes, the FAL and a couple other oddities are like that. However, if people keep dicking around with things an AR upper and lower will both be "firearms", as well as the slide of any semi-auto handgun.

    Want a new slide for your 1911 or Glock? ....well, then you would have to get it shipped to a FFL, do a 4473, and probably a SP4-113 in PA.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J.

    Don't end up in my signature!

  4. #14
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    Feb 2015
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    Montco, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by Carson View Post
    Doesn’t matter. Beto is going to take them either way.
    But now he can inflate his numbers.... Every AR confiscated is TWO firearms!!!!!

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    Mohnton, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by knight0334 View Post
    Yes, the FAL and a couple other oddities are like that. However, if people keep dicking around with things an AR upper and lower will both be "firearms", as well as the slide of any semi-auto handgun.

    Want a new slide for your 1911 or Glock? ....well, then you would have to get it shipped to a FFL, do a 4473, and probably a SP4-113 in PA.
    If you read my posts on this subject you’ll find I said I didn’t want to speculate on the gd internet that never goes away but I have the full realization that gun owners can’t drop shit and will scrutinize, debate and ask for clarification until they create a new restriction. Some are stupid, some are fudds, and some are so worried about breaking the rules but too cheap to pay a lawyer that they need continual banter over it. Don’t read this as applying to you. It’s just my underlying distaste for these open air round table feed the enemy festivals. Make that contempt.
    The Gun is the Badge of a Free Man

  6. #16
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    Feb 2010
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    Levittown, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Guess my absurd post about covering serial numbers with tape and grips, meant to illustrate the lengths to which some of these "protectors of society" will go, has me on your list.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Effort, Pennsylvania
    (Monroe County)
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by knight0334 View Post
    That ruling isn't going to stand for long. The AR lower has (2) of the three requirements. The hammer and the firing mechanism. The finding that it also house the barrel is optional with the word "usually".

    There is also long standing belief that the lower is the receiver.

    If people keep fucking around with the AR legalities you will end up having both the upper and lower ruled to be controlled receivers.

    Definition:
    That part of a firearm which provides housing for the hammer, bolt or breechblock, and firing mechanism, and which is usually threaded at its forward portion to receive the barrel.

    Proof of my argument is practically any semi-auto handgun. The bolt is the slide and breechblock is also the slide - but the gripframe is the receiver. If they rule that an upper is also a receiver, every slide will become a receiver as well.
    Years back this was a discussion and it was brought up that the lower was the reggied part since it accepted the magazine. With the FAL its the upper since it accepts the mag and barrel.

  8. #18
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    Jul 2013
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    Mohnton, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by Bang View Post
    Guess my absurd post about covering serial numbers with tape and grips, meant to illustrate the lengths to which some of these "protectors of society" will go, has me on your list.
    No and no list kept, I do my best to forget the doers but I do hate the actions. I want to debate the ins and outs. I just want to do it in person where conversations are temporary in nature. Anti(s) are parrots not scholars. Mimicking flashy words in emotional attempts to persuade Jack to buy the beans. It’s just has to be a way to make my point without offending but I’m incapable.
    The Gun is the Badge of a Free Man

  9. #19
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    Jul 2013
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    Quote Originally Posted by Kramer View Post
    Years back this was a discussion and it was brought up that the lower was the reggied part since it accepted the magazine. With the FAL its the upper since it accepts the mag and barrel.
    My guess and it’s just a guess. If the barrel is tool less to replace, the part with the fire control group is registered, if the barrel requires tools then that part is registered. But I think no rule you can come up with won’t have an exception.
    The Gun is the Badge of a Free Man

  10. #20
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    Feb 2010
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    Levittown, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: California Judge Says AR Lowers Are NOT Firearms

    I can see where an agency having the responsibility of applying law written for traditional designs can have difficulties. When it begins to be a counting of how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, that may be a sign that new law is needed. That's assuming the continued violating of the 2nd amendment, of course.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

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