He sold illegal AR-15s. Feds let him go free to avoid hurting gun control efforts.

[:-)]

What happens if you want to build one of those uppers into an SBR ?
Do you register the upper, lower or both?

[ExFlyinguy]

What happens if you want to build one of those uppers into an SBR ?
Do you register the upper, lower or both?

There's hardly any point into finishing an 80% lower if you are going to register it as an SBR

[Sgt.K]

There's hardly any point into finishing an 80% lower if you are going to register it as an SBR

[PAMedic=F|A=]

What happens if you want to build one of those uppers into an SBR ?
Do you register the upper, lower or both?

Well, if you have the money to hire a good lawyer, and are willing to go to jail to prove the point.......

Unless I am mis-understanding the situation, technically you would not have an SBR under federal law, because an SBR is a firearm. Because "hammer, bolt or breechblock, and firing mechanism" are not housed in the same frame, it is not a firearm.

I think however, this might be considered a bad idea, nor would I suggest it.

[:-)]

The question is... You want to build an SBR bolt action AR15 (nothing illegal here that's why I said "register" FORM 1 SBR). What part would you register? The bolt action upper because it is the serialized part? The lower 80% or not, because that's how it's usually done or both because it's going to be a short barreled bolt action upper on a AR15 rifle lower?

The whole 80% lower cost and all the tooling needed to finish one...Way over a hundred bucks... Makes no sense to me, when you can just buy a professionally completed lower for $60.00. Sometimes buy a few and get one for free. If there is a ban, the 80% lowers are banned just like the $60 ones...

[flygrimm]

More inconsistencies. The FAL’s upper the one with the SN. So it’s basically the opposite of the AR. Barrel, bolt etc is the firearm and the lower with the fire control group and feed mechanism is just a part. What about the whole HK series? I don’t have one of those.

Stuart

[PAMedic=F|A=]

The question is... You want to build an SBR bolt action AR15 (nothing illegal here that's why I said "register" FORM 1 SBR). What part would you register? The bolt action upper because it is the serialized part? The lower 80% or not, because that's how it's usually done or both because it's going to be a short barreled bolt action upper on a AR15 rifle lower?

The whole 80% lower cost and all the tooling needed to finish one...Way over a hundred bucks... Makes no sense to me, when you can just buy a professionally completed lower for $60.00. Sometimes buy a few and get one for free. If there is a ban, the 80% lowers are banned just like the $60 ones...

Neither. Doesn't meet the legal requirement of a firearm.

Bolt is in the upper frame.

Firing mechanism is in the lower.

Since they have to be in the same frame to be a firearm, nothing you can do, unless you weld the two frames together.

[Delkal]

It seems to me that all it takes is for a company to make some AR uppers, put a serial number on it and start selling rifles with a registered upper. That should be legal since it now appears the BATF does not have the authority to define what the serial numbered part should be (by this lack of a ruling).

THEN they could sell complete unregistered / no serial numbered lowers as a parts kit for their legal rifles with the serial number on top. The lower would not be a firearm and no transfer or background check would be required. Its just parts for their registered upper. They could make a fortune and give the BATF fits.

Of course they will get hassled and eventually arrested. But if the above case is true they should get off if they had enough money left over to get a good lawyer. They complied with Federal law. Just not the BATF's interpretation of the law.

Gunlawyer?

[ExFlyinguy]

It seems to me that all it takes is for a company to make some AR uppers, put a serial number on it and start selling rifles with a registered upper. That should be legal since it now appears the BATF does not have the authority to define what the serial numbered part should be (by this lack of a ruling).

THEN they could sell complete unregistered / no serial numbered lowers as a parts kit for their legal rifles with the serial number on top. The lower would not be a firearm and no transfer or background check would be required. Its just parts for their registered upper. They could make a fortune and give the BATF fits.

Of course they will get hassled and eventually arrested. But if the above case is true they should get off if they had enough money left over to get a good lawyer. They complied with Federal law. Just not the BATF's interpretation of the law.

Gunlawyer?

I'd rather they didn't do that. I'm not so sure milling an upper is as easy as a lower, but what do I know

*Can't we just be happy that they deemed the AR lower the registered part, and with one lower I can have any upper/caliber shipped right to my door

[Delkal]

I'd rather they didn't do that. I'm not so sure milling an upper is as easy as a lower, but what do I know

*Can't we just be happy that they deemed the AR lower the registered part, and with one lower I can have any upper/caliber shipped right to my door

I meant that most companies would still sell parts kits based on a registered lower like they do now........No changes

BUT, the new company could sell parts kits for their rifles that have a serialized upper. So their lower would not have to be registered or marked in any way and you could also get it shipped to your door.