Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #71
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    "Women are to be believed" (a la Kavanaugh) is an absurdity. Almost as absurd as the statement that Ballsy Ford's story was credible.

    As a police investigator, the first duty of an investigation is to establish whether or not a crime has been committed. Sad to say, more claims of rape were phony than real. The most usual reason being to have an explanation why they failed to come home at a normal time.

    I knew a prosecuting attorney who volunteered to work with a victim's rights organization to, as she put it, have someone in there who has their feet on the ground.
    Last edited by Bang; October 19th, 2019 at 11:26 AM.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  2. #72
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    While a police investigator may try to determine whether a crime has been committed, isn't even that ultimately only a tentative determination until someone has actually been convicted of a crime?

    In cases where the identity of an actor is not in question, it is still possible that the actions of that actor do not meet all of the statutory elements of a crime.

    Based on my understanding, the Jury is responsible for determining whether all the statutory elements of the crime actually exist (and were proven beyond a reasonable doubt), and therefore whether a crime has actually been committed. Without a conviction beyond reasonable doubt, the accused is not a criminal and it is therefore possible that no crime was actually committed.

    In this case, it would seem improper to call anyone a "crime victim" until it has been proven that a crime has actually been committed. To do otherwise would be prejudicial against a person who legally stands innocent, (until proven otherwise beyond reasonable doubt).

    ETA: For clarification, I don't believe absence of a conviction necessarily means that no crime was committed (e.g. in cases where the police accuse the wrong person but the real suspect actually committed all of the elements of a crime), but without a conviction, it hasn't been proven that a crime was committed, therefore the existence of a crime victim hasn't been proven.
    Last edited by buckengr; October 19th, 2019 at 09:39 PM.
    I am not a lawyer.

  3. #73
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by JenniferG View Post
    The ACLU and the League of Women's Voters have just initiated a lawsuit against the Commonwealth of PA to remove the question from the ballot because it violates the PA Constitution and laws on amending it.

    https://www.weny.com/story/41167907/...allot-question
    Very glad to see this.
    I hope their legal action is successful in stopping this extremely dangerous amendment to the PA Constitution.
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  4. #74
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    Don't know the machinations, but feel pretty strongly that it should be challenge-able.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  5. #75
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    buckengr, believe me, the body of a person who up until death presented every intention of remaining alive and now lies lifeless with a knife sticking out of their chest is establishment that a crime has been committed; backed up by the the medical examiner who reports that his/her post mortem examination has determined that the manner and cause of death combines to be homicide (death of a person at the hand of another person)...long before any trial by finder of facts, which can be a jury or by a judge.

    Your question is amply covered by the miraculous word "allegedly".
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  6. #76
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by Berncly View Post
    Very glad to see this.
    I hope their legal action is successful in stopping this extremely dangerous amendment to the PA Constitution.
    Please be successful. I fear if this is on the ballot with the paid actresses on that commercial I see NONSTOP, the sheep will pass it.


    On any streaming services, doesn't matter what channel - Roku, Hulu, Pluto, even on kid's Roku channels,, this ad is playing EVERY ad break and sometimes multiple times in a row. It came on FOUR FUCKING TIMES IN A ROW last night in one ad break and my wife said she wants to vote against it just because of that. We mute it every time now. The one woman I referenced earlier, the choking rape victim...sorry to say, but I don't believe her. She seems to be a hired actress to me. If she really went through what she said, I feel sorry for her, no woman should, but using it to push an Unconstitutional stripping of rights doesn't keep me on her side. I'm getting the same vibe as we got during the Kavanaugh witch hunt...that men are all predators and all women tell the truth.

    This law would only make Red Flag Laws easier to obtain and enforce. Who knows, this could be a complete backdoor attempt to get the same effects of a Red Flag Law without having to pass one. I wonder if it would and could be used for taking firearms whena false accusation is made against someone? The whole basis of this law is that every move of the person you ACCUSED of the crime will be reported to you. We're not talking about only convicted people..accused. That's w violation of their rights and scrapping of due process. Until you're convicted of a crime, you have the same rights as the accuser. With this law, that would no longer be true.


    I never thought I'd say this, but can you donate to the ACLU's case against this law? This must be defeated.
    Last edited by alpacaheat; October 21st, 2019 at 12:35 PM.
    Psalms 73:26

  7. #77
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    The lady has a bill named after herself too, "Karen's Law":

    http://www.senatorsabatina.com/sabat...ary-committee/

    “The current parole re-application process does not adequately address the trauma experienced by survivors,” Sabatina said. “Senate Bill 1023 addresses the emotional needs of victims.”



    SB 1023 to limit parole of sex offenders:
    https://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs...type=b&bn=1023


    Psalms 73:26

  8. #78
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by alpacaheat View Post
    The lady has a bill named after herself too, "Karen's Law":

    http://www.senatorsabatina.com/sabat...ary-committee/

    “The current parole re-application process does not adequately address the trauma experienced by survivors,” Sabatina said. “Senate Bill 1023 addresses the emotional needs of victims.”



    SB 1023 to limit parole of sex offenders:
    https://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs...type=b&bn=1023


    Almost everyone in that pic has the same, smug, low-IQ self-satisfied SJW smirk.

    It's the same hateful schadenfreude expression I've seen on old photos of people watching a lynching. Weird.

    It seems to me that false allegations regarding sexual assault are much more common than false allegations in most other crimes. Plenty of people falsely claim for insurance purposes that "someone" stole their car or burned down their business, but it's only in the sex area that people falsely accuse specific individuals of crimes to this extent. It's like the go-to gambit for attention whores, the way that racial hate crimes are in some sectors (where Jussie Smollett lives, for example).

    My impression is that people who just hate men are drawn to the N.O.W. and to groups obsessed with sexual assault. There are certainly sexual assault incidents, and there 's certainly a role for a group pushing women's rights, but when they get taken over by people with a different agenda, things go south. N.O.W. seems to be co-opted by man-hating lesbians, and the sexual assault issue seems like a magnet for women with generalized rage issues.

    Don't get me wrong; a serial rapist should be shot behind the courthouse after a fair trial. But too many women decide they were raped after he doesn't call the next day, and too many stage moms decide that their baby was molested at day care because their little princess has a butt rash (see the McMartin preschool case for a modern day Salem witch trial).

    Obsessive angry people are muddying the waters and making it harder to achieve real justice in America today. On a related note, I was not a fan of Trump pardoning Alice Johnson, the leader of a drug gang, just because she was a black woman. She was not the "good person left in prison because of racist drug laws", her gang killed people.
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
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  9. #79
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    Almost everyone in that pic has the same, smug, low-IQ self-satisfied SJW smirk.

    It's the same hateful schadenfreude expression I've seen on old photos of people watching a lynching. Weird.

    It seems to me that false allegations regarding sexual assault are much more common than false allegations in most other crimes. Plenty of people falsely claim for insurance purposes that "someone" stole their car or burned down their business, but it's only in the sex area that people falsely accuse specific individuals of crimes to this extent. It's like the go-to gambit for attention whores, the way that racial hate crimes are in some sectors (where Jussie Smollett lives, for example).

    My impression is that people who just hate men are drawn to the N.O.W. and to groups obsessed with sexual assault. There are certainly sexual assault incidents, and there 's certainly a role for a group pushing women's rights, but when they get taken over by people with a different agenda, things go south. N.O.W. seems to be co-opted by man-hating lesbians, and the sexual assault issue seems like a magnet for women with generalized rage issues.

    Don't get me wrong; a serial rapist should be shot behind the courthouse after a fair trial. But too many women decide they were raped after he doesn't call the next day, and too many stage moms decide that their baby was molested at day care because their little princess has a butt rash (see the McMartin preschool case for a modern day Salem witch trial).

    Obsessive angry people are muddying the waters and making it harder to achieve real justice in America today. On a related note, I was not a fan of Trump pardoning Alice Johnson, the leader of a drug gang, just because she was a black woman. She was not the "good person left in prison because of racist drug laws", her gang killed people.
    That group smirk does look well rehearsed.
    Where's Hunter?

  10. #80
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    (Monroe County)
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    Default Re: Amending the PA constitution via Marsy’s Law on 2019 ballot

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    Almost everyone in that pic has the same, smug, low-IQ self-satisfied SJW smirk.

    It's the same hateful schadenfreude expression I've seen on old photos of people watching a lynching. Weird.

    It seems to me that false allegations regarding sexual assault are much more common than false allegations in most other crimes. Plenty of people falsely claim for insurance purposes that "someone" stole their car or burned down their business, but it's only in the sex area that people falsely accuse specific individuals of crimes to this extent. It's like the go-to gambit for attention whores, the way that racial hate crimes are in some sectors (where Jussie Smollett lives, for example).

    My impression is that people who just hate men are drawn to the N.O.W. and to groups obsessed with sexual assault. There are certainly sexual assault incidents, and there 's certainly a role for a group pushing women's rights, but when they get taken over by people with a different agenda, things go south. N.O.W. seems to be co-opted by man-hating lesbians, and the sexual assault issue seems like a magnet for women with generalized rage issues.

    Don't get me wrong; a serial rapist should be shot behind the courthouse after a fair trial. But too many women decide they were raped after he doesn't call the next day, and too many stage moms decide that their baby was molested at day care because their little princess has a butt rash (see the McMartin preschool case for a modern day Salem witch trial).

    Obsessive angry people are muddying the waters and making it harder to achieve real justice in America today. On a related note, I was not a fan of Trump pardoning Alice Johnson, the leader of a drug gang, just because she was a black woman. She was not the "good person left in prison because of racist drug laws", her gang killed people.
    if it was as easy to claim your car was stolen and get away with it as it is to falsely make claims about a sex crime and get away with it, people would be claiming their cars were missing just as frequently.
    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” – John Stark

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