Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    Just more Libtard Nanny nonsense,

    Can I carry a butter knife??
    Its easier to fool people than to convince them they've been fooled....Mark Twain

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    Quote Originally Posted by PocketProtector View Post
    Can I carry a butter knife??
    If you have sufficient upper body strength, I imagine so.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    so a Leatherman is OK then?

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Boondox View Post
    This is certainly not everything and I did not bookmark my findings and the amount of info abounds and if you look for a bit there is a bunch of stuff but but just as a starter ..............I copy and paste

    The knife was A sheath knife featuring a handle that could be locked either perpendicular to the axis of the blade or straight in line with the blade ... not one I see as illegal per the law we keep repeating here............ but I could be wrong
    And as I understand it .... This case also ruled that "self-defense" is not a valid "lawful purpose" because the court felt that would invalidate the entire point of the law in the first place.



    Commonwealth v Lawson, 977 A2d 583 (2009).

    The defendant was the subject of police intervention in response to a disturbance involving weapons at a convenience store. He was charged with possession of an instrument with no common lawful purpose. At the trial, the prosecution presented an expert witness whose qualification was three decades of experience in selling knives as a sporting goods retailer. His opinion was that the knife had no lawful purpose. He conceded it could be used for whittling or field dressing of game but would be awkward for such tasks. The conviction at trial was upheld on appeal where the court observed that a conceivable lawful purpose can be offered for almost any item which is insufficient to establish common lawful use.
    How does being a sporting goods retailer make him an expert at knives? Was he an experienced field guide as well? A knife maker who designs knives for specific tasks? Doug Marcaida? Unless he has some real bonafides, his opinion simply a 'retailer' doesn't hold much water to me. I'm always amazed at the lack of vetting I see regarding so-called 'expert witnesses' and what judges will allow.

    But I also have a feeling there's more to this story than just a guy who happened to be carrying a knife while getting gas and a Big Gulp.


    OP, I carry a small fixed blade fairly regularly. I find them useful for all sorts of tasks... self defense being very low on my priority list. If you like the TDI, and find the blade useful, I say more power to you. There is nothing I can see in PA law making it inherently illegal. Just understand any local ordinances, as preemption doesn't apply to knives. I'd also recommend understanding the local 'culture' of where you're carrying in, and conceal accordingly. Walking around a Home Depot, a job site, or a somewhere people see knives as just tools, you're probably not gonna get a second look. Strolling through Target, a mall, or somewhere uptight soccer moms frequent, you might wanna let your shirt cover it. Just my opinion, and of course, IANAL....

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    Today laws are made so that they may used anytime politicians want to punish people for whatever reason. Laws are made so they are purposely vague and they can prosecute you anytime they want for whatever reasons they choose. This is clearly unConstitutional but hey, why does that matter now the Constitution has been trampled under foot for so long now no one even remembers the purpose of it.
    Corruption is the default behavior of government officials. JPC

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Boondox View Post
    In my view they have completely neutered a simply phrase such as "common lawful purpose" ... so anything is possible and the Constitution has become just something to "get around" by many.
    While I served in the US Navy under the UCMJ they had Article 134 which is called General Articles. It means nothing more than a catch all in case they want to prosecute for something that's not specifically enumerated.

    I worked for the railroad for 33 years and in my Transportation Department days we ran under a few different authorities until NORAC was instituted. When you ran into unsignaled territory or the track conditions could not be determined you ran under The Restricting rule which meant that if anything happened to your train while running under the Restricting rule it was your fault and action would be taken against you. Granted, these were all conditions of employment but it appears that the politicians now make laws and the courts support them to make everyday living as Article 134 and the Restricting rule all wrapped up into one so that you don't stand a chance against the system of laws that were designed to be a catch all.
    Corruption is the default behavior of government officials. JPC

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    Quote Originally Posted by R L Suehr View Post
    Where does it say that? Here's the definition of "prohibited offensive weapon" from 908:

    "Offensive weapons." Any bomb, grenade, machine gun, sawed-off shotgun with a barrel less than 18 inches, firearm specially made or specially adapted for concealment or silent discharge, any blackjack, sandbag, metal knuckles, dagger, knife, razor or cutting instrument, the blade of which is exposed in an automatic way by switch, push-button, spring mechanism, or otherwise, any stun gun, stun baton, taser or other electronic or electric weapon or other implement for the infliction of serious bodily injury which serves no common lawful purpose.

    Doesn't say anything about a "fighting knife". It says it has to have a common lawful purpose. You can open boxes with it. You could cut cord with it. You could do any number of lawful things with it, including self defense. It's really not that odd of a design. There's skinning knives that are similar.
    That reads more like assisted opening Kershaws would be a bigger law issue than a Jabari tdi

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Knife question , opinion , etc

    I believe as long as you have a LTCF you're good, as one of the more interesting 2A cases that went through PA courts in recent years was not actually a gun case, but a knife one.


    Below is the blog by the attory who fought the case.


    https://blog.princelaw.com/2017/02/1...hool-property/



    Followed by another explanation by an unrelated legal team


    https://goldsteinmehta.com/blog/pa-s...rounds-statute


    Contrary to the trial court’s conclusion, the “other lawful purpose” language does not restrict the defense provided in Section 912(c). Instead, the phrase does just the opposite: it expands the defense to include any additional or different lawful reason not otherwise mentioned in the first clause of Section 912(c), regardless of whether it is school-related. To conclude otherwise, would make “possessed for other lawful purpose” redundant with “possessed and used in association with a lawful supervised school activity or course.”

    The Superior Court's holding in Goslin is very broad. It means that if the defense can produce evidence of a lawful purpose for which the weapon was possessed, the prosecution likely should not be able to obtain a conviction under the statute. As always, we do not advocate testing the limits of these statutes. If you bring a knife to a school, you will probably still be arrested and forced to deal with the expense and risk of a criminal prosecution. But this decision clearly establishes that if there was a lawful purpose for possessing the weapon, then the Commonwealth may not prevail in a prosecution under this statute.

    Emphasis mine.
    Last edited by PAMedic=F|A=; September 30th, 2019 at 11:49 AM.
    "Cives Arma Ferant"

    "I know I'm not James Bond, that's why I don't keep a loaded gun under the pillow, or bang Russian spies on a regular basis." - GunLawyer001

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