Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
Page 6 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456
Results 51 to 58 of 58
  1. #51
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Richboro, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    100
    Rep Power
    1018226

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Argh! Too many choices!

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Somewhere, Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
    Posts
    1,373
    Rep Power
    13428138

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_NEPhila View Post
    TLDR, no, it is not worth it.

    I do not get it either. Pistol cartridges are a trade off of recoil, energy and portability. The utility of a pistol is that it is easy to carry. To remove that utility and retain the cartridge that does not perform well compared to other cartridges in similar sized devices seems silly to me. For example, why would I want something that weighs as much as an AR15 that does not have the energy, range or penetration that an AR15 would have? 1000 bucks for what is essentially a large, heavy pistol does not make sense.

    I really do not see the justification for the price, this is a straight blowback device. Mechanically, it is the simplest of systems that have a very forgiving set of tolerances. It is far easier to make this Scorpion thing than it is to make an AR15, yet the price is twice what the discount ARs are... marketing fizz.

    If this is about inexpensive target practice, the Smith and Wesson M&P AR15-22 is hard to beat. The controls are exactly where God and Eugene Stoner intended them, plus it looks cool.
    What's wrong with just liking a gun anymore? It doesn't have to be anymore complicated than "Hey, this thing is fucking cool. I have the money; I'm gonna buy it!"
    "Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle"

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    On top of a hill, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    8,124
    Rep Power
    21474851

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
    What's wrong with just liking a gun anymore? It doesn't have to be anymore complicated than "Hey, this thing is fucking cool. I have the money; I'm gonna buy it!"
    And well because PCC matches require a PCC. Thereís also a pretty strong case for the right PCC for HD VS a standard pistol.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Plymouth Meeting, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
    Posts
    2,485
    Rep Power
    2493157

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
    What's wrong with just liking a gun anymore? It doesn't have to be anymore complicated than "Hey, this thing is fucking cool. I have the money; I'm gonna buy it!"
    Nothing is wrong with it. The question was about a value proposition.

    A PCC for home defense seems silly to me especially considering that the vast majority of 9mm defensive ammo is optimized for pistol barrel lengths. Lucky Gunner recently did a video on this very topic on youtube. A performance decrease was shown in PCCs due to the projectile being outside of its design envelope. Higher velocity for a bullet designed for a specific speed can make the projectile become much less effective.

    Speaking of HD, would a PCC work, yep. However, what would you rather have? 30 rounds of 5.56 in your hands or 30 rounds of 9mm? My choice is the 5.56, every single time...
    Join the groups protecting your rights from the fools trying to take them from you!

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    On top of a hill, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    8,124
    Rep Power
    21474851

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_NEPhila View Post
    Nothing is wrong with it. The question was about a value proposition.

    A PCC for home defense seems silly to me especially considering that the vast majority of 9mm defensive ammo is optimized for pistol barrel lengths. Lucky Gunner recently did a video on this very topic on youtube. A performance decrease was shown in PCCs due to the projectile being outside of its design envelope. Higher velocity for a bullet designed for a specific speed can make the projectile become much less effective.

    Speaking of HD, would a PCC work, yep. However, what would you rather have? 30 rounds of 5.56 in your hands or 30 rounds of 9mm? My choice is the 5.56, every single time...
    Like everything else individual circumstances matter. I live on 25 acres of land so I donít have to worry much about neighbors and things like that. Most people do have to worry about those things. Location of your room, your loved ones rooms matter much. Permanent hearing damage, something almost no one really considers until your deaf for the rest of your life. You can easily suppress a 9mm, not so much for the 5.56 especially in confined quarters.

    The PCC definitely has its place including in law enforcement and warfare where they are still used. There are loads that perform well in it and now I believe Federal has a PCC line.

    My wife likes a PCC not so much for the AR. Sheís more accurate and faster with a PCC vs a pistol and most people would be as well. While Iím comfortable with an AR I would have little objection to using a good PCC for HD, would I want one on the battlefield well no but Iím not going to war when I go to bed every night either.

    Like I said thereís still an excellent case to be made for the PCC especially when comparing it to a pistol.
    Last edited by Hodgie; November 26th, 2019 at 03:57 PM.

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Richboro, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    100
    Rep Power
    1018226

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronin View Post
    What's wrong with just liking a gun anymore? It doesn't have to be anymore complicated than "Hey, this thing is fucking cool. I have the money; I'm gonna buy it!"
    Quote Originally Posted by Hodgie View Post
    And well because PCC matches require a PCC. There’s also a pretty strong case for the right PCC for HD VS a standard pistol.
    At least for me, these are the main points for getting one. For PCC class competition and a range toy. I live in suburbia and I do worry about penetrating through walls as the neighbor's houses while not on top of me are not miles away either. Say 60 - 150 feet, corner lot so only one house is close everything else either has to cross two backyards or streets.

    I did end up getting a CZ Scorpion carbine! Fun and accurate.

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Oakland Mills, Pennsylvania
    (Juniata County)
    Posts
    3,310
    Rep Power
    21474846

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_NEPhila View Post
    TLDR, no, it is not worth it.

    I do not get it either. Pistol cartridges are a trade off of recoil, energy and portability. The utility of a pistol is that it is easy to carry. To remove that utility and retain the cartridge that does not perform well compared to other cartridges in similar sized devices seems silly to me. For example, why would I want something that weighs as much as an AR15 that does not have the energy, range or penetration that an AR15 would have? 1000 bucks for what is essentially a large, heavy pistol does not make sense.

    I really do not see the justification for the price, this is a straight blowback device. Mechanically, it is the simplest of systems that have a very forgiving set of tolerances. It is far easier to make this Scorpion thing than it is to make an AR15, yet the price is twice what the discount ARs are... marketing fizz.

    If this is about inexpensive target practice, the Smith and Wesson M&P AR15-22 is hard to beat. The controls are exactly where God and Eugene Stoner intended them, plus it looks cool.
    This is why I want someone to make a rimless .357 mag. Not rounds that pretend they are, but actually .357. For carbines that are not lever guns.
    "Cives Arma Ferant"

    "I know I'm not James Bond, that's why I don't keep a loaded gun under the pillow, or bang Russian spies on a regular basis." - GunLawyer001

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Somewhere, Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
    Posts
    1,373
    Rep Power
    13428138

    Default Re: CZ Scorpion Carbine, is it worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by PAMedic=F|A= View Post
    This is why I want someone to make a rimless .357 mag. Not rounds that pretend they are, but actually .357. For carbines that are not lever guns.
    Well, you have .357 Sig on one end and .357 AR Max on the other end. Both are rimless and can be fired out of a carbine. .357 Sig can also be shot from a pistol, so you have shared ammo. Not so much with .357 AR Max.
    "Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle"

Page 6 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456

Similar Threads

  1. CZ Scorpion Carbine
    By wellcraft in forum Rifles
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: June 19th, 2016, 06:44 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Local gun shops | Local shooting ranges | Philadelphia Shooting Ranges | Philadelphia Gun Shops | Pittsburgh Shooting Ranges | Pittsburgh Gun Shops