Why I will support Trump 2020, we need to learn the lesson of places like New York

[internet troll]

There is a thread about this guy from New York already. I am starting a new thread because of how I see it tying into the 2020 election and the importance of Trump winning in 2020 for the 2nd despite his imperfections on the issue. The story is a take on the New York guy who defended himself that I think reinforces something Gunlawyer once said about the legal system mostly disliking gun owners. The more I read about the story the more I feel for this guy. He did not have a lot of money and could not afford electricity for his house. The gun had belonged to his deceased dad. He would have had to spent a lot of money to make the gun “in New York’s eyes” legal for him to own. Money he obviously did not have. Talk about discrimination against poor people.

The guy successfully defends himself. In this scenario the guy could easily have been harmed or killed. Now the state is trying to crush him.

These are the type of stories gun owners need to remember when politicians start talking about Common Sense Gun Laws. Common sense gun laws wind up hurting citizens who have no criminal intent for the gun. A lot of the politicians on the left want to enact New York common sense gun laws on the federal level. Some gun owners are okay with that. They are fine with common sense gun laws. While searching for articles to put in the self defense thread, I often come across letters to the editor from gun owners who start off by saying “I own guns but......”

States like New York, Maryland, New Jersey and California are a road map for what antis want at the federal level. They are in actuality a warning to gun owners for just how much they want to impede on the 2nd and a citizens right to defend themselves. This is not a vague statement...... Just look at what Stolarczyk is going through.

This is also why I still defend Trump despite his (in my eyes) betrayals with bump stocks. This is why I will not sit out the 2020 election or vote for a 3rd party candidate. Trump is far from perfect, but I don’t think we will get New York type of restrictions under him nor will he push for it. If a Kamala Harris, Corey Booker, Eric Swalwell, Warren etc...get into the Whitehouse, I can easily see them spending any political capital they have on creating New York style common sense laws at the federal level.

A lot of people like to make the point that Obama did less to harm the 2nd than Trump because of bump stocks. I see the point but it was not from Obama not trying. He went after guns hard during his 2nd term. I truly believe that he had spent most of his political capital on Obama care in his first term. If he had gone after guns instead of Obamacare our 2nd Amendment landscape would be different right now for the worse. In part because of Obamacare, Republicans (who do still have a lot of pro 2nd candidates or will at least vote against anti 2nd legislation) took the house and senate. This basically rendered Obama impotent as he pushed for common sense gun control during his 2nd term.

Between the Democratic push for “New York style gun control” and the importance of putting non anti judges on the Supreme Court, I will be voting for Trump. Is he perfect for the 2nd?....... faaarrrrrr from it in my eyes. Is he light years ahead of his opponents?...... absolutely.

https://hotair.com/archives/2019/06/...efending-home/

This is probably one of my least favorite subjects to cover, but it’s the sort of thing we need to remain aware of. Questions of self-defense, the castle doctrine and home security come up often enough, and they can impact nearly anyone in the country if your luck runs low. But a story from upstate New York is now making the rounds for an unusual reason. The Daily Signal has the story of Ronald Stolarczyk, who lives in the Utica, New York region. He found himself forced into a position where he had to use lethal force to save his life in his own home when armed intruders broke in. He thankfully survived (the intruders did not) but that turned out to only be the beginning of his problems.

[L]ook to the case of Ronald Stolarczyk of Oneida County, New York. He’s now facing felony charges for lawfully protecting himself against criminals without first getting the county’s permission to possess a handgun in his home—something that would cost him hundreds of dollars and months of paperwork.

The 64-year-old Stolarczyk was “minding his own business in his kitchen” one day when he heard voices coming from his garage. Stolarczyk tried simply waiting for the intruders to leave, but the two assailants soon ascended the stairs and attempted to enter his central living space.

Stolarczyk then yelled at the burglars to leave, hoping that knowledge of his presence would scare them away. The burglars were undeterred by his warning, and one even aggressively advanced toward him.
With two intruders in his garage and attempting to break into the rest of the house despite repeated verbal warnings, Stolarczyk retrieved his .38-caliber revolver and fired multiple shots at the intruders, killing both of them. He proceeded to immediately contact the police who arrived and determined that it was a case of self-defense, so the homeowner wouldn’t be charged with killing them. Sounds like a happy ending, right?

Not so much. Instead of charging Stolarczyk with murder, they charged him with illegal possession of a handgun and he’s now facing a possible sentence of four years. The case is complicated because of how he came to be in possession of the revolver. The gun belonged to his father, who shared the home with him. The father passed away, leaving all of his possessions (including the gun) to his son. There’s no report of him carrying it outside the home. It was simply in the house. But Stolarczyk never went through the mind-numbing process of trying to apply for a handgun permit in his home county.

It’s also worth noting that Stolarczyk was in such financial distress that he couldn’t even afford to keep the electricity on at his home, to say nothing of paying the endless fees involved in trying to get a permit to own a handgun. If this guy winds up doing time over a “crime” like this, there’s simply no justice in the unhinged state of New York.

Making it worth the click above, the Daily Signal walked through the entire process of attempting to get the permit that Stolarczyk lacked. You should read it. You could probably get permission to build a new nuclear power plant more quickly and cheaply than jumping through all of those hoops.

[internet troll]

This is part of an article about the hoops people in New York jump through. This is the least that non Trump candidates will want in 2020. And Keep in mind New York is still pushing for more gun control. Do we really want to open the door to this type of potential gun control by sitting out 2020 or voting for a 3rd party candidate? In 2012 somewhat pro gun forces had control of the house and senate putting a check on Obama. The 2020 candidate may not have that check.



https://www.dailysignal.com/2019/06/...ampaign=tds-tw

Just How Bad Is the Local System?

On the one hand, this case is a clear example of prosecutorial discretion run amok. Most people would agree that Stolarczyk, an otherwise law-abiding citizen, should not be criminally punished after calling the police on himself to report the justified use of lethal force against burglars.

On the other hand, these charges expose a deeper problem stemming from the severe burden that Oneida County places on residents’ Second Amendment rights.

To fully appreciate how inappropriate these charges are, we decided to find out exactly what it takes to obtain a pistol permit in Oneida County—again, the only thing Stolarczyk allegedly failed to do properly here.

It turns out that, after a lengthy investigation, we’re still not certain we fully understand the process. Our best educated guess is something like the following:

First, anyone interested in owning a handgun must pick up the application in person, which can only be done at the Oneida County Office Building. But prepare to take time off work, because this building is only open Monday through Friday from 8:30 a.m. to 12 p.m., and 1 p.m. to 3:30 p.m.

Alternatively, if you live on the opposite side of the county and want to avoid a 50-minute drive to Utica, you can try the Griffiss Business and Technology Park office, open on Thursdays between 8 a.m. and 12 p.m.

Once at the Office of Pistol Licensing, you’ll need to present a New York state driver’s license proving that you’re at least 21 years old and have lived in Oneida County for at least one year.

You also must provide a certificate of completion for an NRA Basic Pistol Course, which lasts approximately eight hours and must be led by a county-approved instructor.

After calling many of the recommended instructors, we learned that the introductory course can cost anywhere between $40 and $165 and that classes aren’t necessarily offered on a regular basis.

Further, had we not called these instructors and the licensing office itself for clarification, it would have been nearly impossible to determine which courses Oneida County does and does not accept to meet the requirement.

Finally, after paying a $10 processing fee to the county, you can receive the application form and begin the process of seeking the county’s permission to own a gun in your own home.

The application itself consists of five parts, which must be completed in black ink, and all signatures on the form must be notarized. Two identical head shot photographs no larger than 2 x 2 inches must be attached to the application.

Each application also requires four notarized character references from individuals 21 years of age or older, who are not related to the applicant, and who reside in Oneida County.

After completing the application, you will be responsible for paying several additional fees for processing and fingerprinting. These include $150 to the Oneida County Sheriff’s Office, $100 to the Utica Police Department, or $50 to the Rome Police Department, depending on the jurisdiction in which you reside.

All payments must be made through a postal money order, which requires a trip to the post office—and possibly additional research if, like many people, you have no idea what a postal money order is or where to get one.

There will then be a six-month waiting period for processing, after which you’ll be informed whether your application was accepted or denied. Denials can occur for a myriad of reasons, including seemingly arbitrary determinations by the application processor that you are not “of good moral character.”

An Onerous Burden

This is the complex and costly system that Stolarczyk—who couldn’t afford to keep his lights on—needed to navigate in order to legally own the revolver that may have saved his life.

That’s not to say the government can never impose any requirements on gun owners, or regulate the manner in which firearms are purchased or carried outside the home. The Second Amendment right, like all other enumerated rights, is not unlimited.

But examples like this make clear that laborious and costly gun licensing requirements impose substantial and undue burdens on the exercise of the right to keep and bear arms—burdens we would never allow to be imposed on another fundamental constitutional right.

Worse still, these burdens fall heaviest on the shoulders of those who, unlike many of the wealthy politicians calling for gun control, can’t afford to live in gated communities and will never receive a police escort.

No level of government—be it federal, state, or local—should get away with imposing such great barriers to exercising a constitutional right.

It certainly shouldn’t punish individuals whose only crime was failing to properly navigate a nightmarishly complex and expensive web of bureaucracy prior to defending their life, liberty, and property with a handgun.

[gghbi]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to internet troll again.

I.T. beat me to posting the process as he did above...

http://ocgov.net/sites/default/files...ctions2019.pdf

[internet troll]

Another story of a man who used a firearm to defend themself against an intruder. I don’t know the background of this guy and if he was able to own a gun, a good person or a bad person. he was charged with possession of firearm however. (He was also charged with possession of marijuana). But it does go to show how New York style gun control trips people up and allows them to go after you for reasons outside of defending yourself. doesn’t matter if you successfully use a firearm to defend/ protect yourself...... they will find a way to make you regret defending yourself.

I’m of the mind that tying non gun related offenses and criteria to owning a gun is against the 2nd. But that boat has sailed and non firearm criteria (i.e smoking/possession of marijuana) are attached to the right to own guns. Voting for any of the non Trump candidates or not voting at all will allow a greater attack on the 2nd in that they will add more and more ways to trip up gun owners.

https://www.silive.com/crime/2019/06...-resident.html

Charges filed against man in Staten Island teen-shooting twist
By Irene Spezzamonte | ispezzamonte@siadvance.com
Updated Jun 21, 4:25 PM; Posted Jun 21, 4:06 PM
STATEN ISLAND, N.Y. -- Police have filed drug and weapon charges against a man who they say fatally shot a teen who tried to break into his shed in Richmond Valley early Thursday morning.

Anthony Lampo, 57, was charged with possession of marijuana and possession of a firearm, according to a spokesman for the NYPD’s Deputy Commissioner of Public Information.

He is not charged with the death of Christopher Redmond, 19, of Pleasant Plains.

Lampo, who resided in a living space above the detached shed on the 600 block of Page Avenue, told police he heard banging and the sound of breaking glass at around 4 a.m. on Thursday, law enforcement sources told the Advance.

Christopher Redmond, 19, of Pleasant Plains, was found shot to death on Page Avenue in Richmond Valley. (Family photo)
Christopher Redmond, 19, of Pleasant Plains, was found shot to death on Page Avenue in Richmond Valley. (Family photo)
He told police he came down and encountered Redmond wearing a mask and warned him he had a gun.

A struggle ensued over the shotgun and a shot was fired, mortally wounding Redmond, the resident told cops. The teen staggered out to Page Avenue.

He attempted to call 911 from his cell phone in a desperate bid for help before he collapsed to the ground.

He was pronounced dead at Staten Island University Hospital in Prince’s Bay.

When police responded to Page Avenue, they found the bloody cell phone and a mask and gloves next to Redmond, sources said.

They also found a small amount of marijuana in the shed, sources said.

Police are trying to determine why Redmond chose Lampo’s residence, and whether Redmond was there alone.

Lampo is expected to be in Criminal Court in St. George Saturday.

Further information will be posted as it becomes available.

[internet troll]

Imagine this scenario, someone other than Trump gets into office in 2020 and they win the house and senate. Common sense gun control gets through and they outlaw certain weapons on the federal level. (AR’s, semiautomatic handguns over a capacity of say 10 rounds). American are given the choice to turn their weapons in and dispose of high capacity hand guns. The majority of gun owners choose not to turn in their weapons figuring things might change and no one will ever know.

No one will ever know unless you have to defend yourself like one of the guys above and you use a now illegal gun or magazine. Doesn’t matter that you defended yourself, now they get you on one of the other contingency’s. You are screwed.

Booker, Warren, Sanders, etc.... would love to see these type of gun laws put into place.

[JenniferG]

I think Booker will win right after Biden apologizes for being white.

[Fortytwo]

A 6-3 majority (perhaps, one dares to hope, even a 7-2 majority) in the SCotUS is all the reason I need.

[Yoder]

Why I will support Trump in 2020- He's not a Democrat.

[unclejumbo]

The tired trope that Trump has enacted more gun control than Obama makes me mad. It's parroted by people that are more interested in memes than know their subject.

The Obama administration removed the right to own a firearm from some SS recipients.

In July 2015, the Social Security Administration (SSA) proposed — and in December 2016 issued — new rules to “implement provisions of the NICS Improvement Amendments Act of 2007 (NIAA) that require Federal agencies to provide relevant records to the Attorney General for inclusion in the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS).”

The rule update was originally tagged as part of an effort by the Obama administration to strengthen gun control efforts after the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting, efforts that include trying to plug holes in the firearms purchase background check system. The intent of the rule is to bring the Social Security Administration in line with other laws that regulate who gets reported to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS), a database used to prevent gun sales to excluded classes such as felons, drug addicts, dishonorably discharged service members, fugitives, and illegal immigrants.

The rule would require that the Social Security Administration report to the Attorney General, for inclusion in the NICS, Social Security recipients who have been deemed unable to manage their own affairs due to “marked subnormal intelligence, or mental illness, incompetency, condition, or disease”:

Trump undid that. He restored the rights of those people. While I'm not happy about bumpstocks, it pales in comparison to people being barred from owning firearms because they can't manage their finances.

[internet troll]

A 6-3 majority (perhaps, one dares to hope, even a 7-2 majority) in the SCotUS is all the reason I need.

You’re right about that. I was planning on posting this sometime in the next week or two.

One of the big things over the next 5 years is Ginsburg will most likely be replaced. Trump has kept his word appointing people from his list he put out while he was running. Gorsuch was a good pick and Kavanaugh is way better than anyone who I see the democrats putting out there.

This is also why the Senate is so important in 2020. I was not a fan when democrats reduced the amount of votes from 60 to a majority to appoint judges. It was only a matter of time before this was applied to the Supreme Court. The democrats decision came back to bite them. Reducing the votes for the Supreme Court could come back to bite republicans if they win both the White House and the senate. Although in all honestly they would probably of reduced the amount of votes to a majority anyway if they control both the senate and White House in 2020 and they have a chance to replace Ginsburg but not the votes to do so.

I am surprised that non of the democratic 2020 candidates have put out their own list yet. I can see one candidate and them getting into an arms race to see who can have the most left leaning judges on the court.

When I think about the impact Trump has had, the Supreme Court is number one. Being a last ditch stop for gun control legislation (hopefully) is up there on the list, but has not been needed with the Republicans controlling the Senate.

It’s easy to criticize Trump or any standing president for what do in office and talk about how you want someone else in there. But I really think people need to apply abstract thinking to the situation when analyzing it. You need to think about the “what ifs” if someone else were in office. If Hillary had one she would have replaced Scalia, Ginsburg and possibly Kennedy. The Supreme Court has unfortunately become more powerful over the years and it’s importance is greater than ever. If Hillary had won, who knows what gun control cases the court might accept over the next next decade or two. Heller..... easily over turned. Semi autos, high capacity magazines, easily gone if they reached the court.

Ginsburg’s seat will most likely be up. A lot of people might say “meh, not enough to vote for Trump, we will still have a majority”. But once again abstract thinking is needed. Breyer is now in his 80’s, what if he has a heart attack, What if Gorsuch chokes on a piece of steak. What if Kavenaugh get’s attacked by a herd of attack kittens? What if Clarence Thomas gets into a car accident?

I don’t like how powerful the Supreme Court has become and its importance in the election. But that does not mean I can deny the importance and turn the other way, not vote and make it easier for one of the antigun candidates to win the election and control the court picks for the next 4 years. Not just the Supreme Court, but all the other judges Trump has been appointing at the federal level.

The importance of the Supreme Court can not be over stated. Forty two is right. I have a lot of reasons I will be voting for Trump, but the Supreme Court is all I really need.