Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    POCONO MOUNTAINS, PENNSYLVANIA, Pennsylvania
    (Monroe County)
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    68
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Yeah that works well,Just Imagine needing your firearm in the event of a life or death struggle ? Not to mention a blank still has explosive capabilities so I am inclined to believe its still a loaded firearm unless disproved with a law citing and stating its not.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    814, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    462
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    2127713

    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Quote Originally Posted by Emptymag View Post
    I never would have considered this in regards to honor guards. Probably because I assume they would know better than to keep live ammo in a firearm like that - blanks or not - legal or not.
    These Honor Guards do an important job I believe. And they run on volunteers and VFW's are for the most part struggling to find people.
    Esp younger folks.
    They do what they can with what they got and often go out of their way to help their community and members in it .... often with little given back.
    A little off track I am getting but I am not here to kick them around but I think because they are blanks .... maybe they get a little complacent in the handling of the rifles.
    Often VFW's change who is in charge of the rifles due to the last person passing on.... and maybe the new guy doesn't realize , etc , etc.
    But I have probably come across more rifles loaded with blanks .... than not loaded with them.
    Kind of surprised me at first to be honest ... but I've come to expect it.
    I think some Honor Guard Captains or Quartermasters have listened to what I've said ...but I'd like to have accurate info before I pass it along.
    And so here I am...........

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
    (Allegheny County)
    Posts
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Good deal. Always good to try to prevent people from breaking laws unknowingly, and/or hurting themselves unintentionally.

    I don't know what kind of blanks are used, but the 5.56 and 7.62x39 blanks I have don't have a projectile - just powder in a crimped off casing.
    I know that I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of the gas coming out of the barrel though - it's enough to propel a grenade several hundred feet, so I wouldn't consider it much safer than handling a rifle with a live round.
    PAFOA GROUP SHOOT & BACON FEST! - Saturday June 15th - Click for info!

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Lehigh Valley, Pennsylvania
    (Lehigh County)
    Posts
    2,205
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boondox View Post
    These Honor Guards do an important job I believe. And they run on volunteers and VFW's are for the most part struggling to find people.
    Esp younger folks.
    They do what they can with what they got and often go out of their way to help their community and members in it .... often with little given back.
    A little off track I am getting but I am not here to kick them around but I think because they are blanks .... maybe they get a little complacent in the handling of the rifles.
    Often VFW's change who is in charge of the rifles due to the last person passing on.... and maybe the new guy doesn't realize , etc , etc.
    But I have probably come across more rifles loaded with blanks .... than not loaded with them.
    Kind of surprised me at first to be honest ... but I've come to expect it.
    I think some Honor Guard Captains or Quartermasters have listened to what I've said ...but I'd like to have accurate info before I pass it along.
    And so here I am...........
    It is true this is an important job. It is unfortunate that the playing of Taps has been replaced by recordings because of the lack of bugle players. The time and effort put into doing this is appreciated by lot of folks out there who do not know what is involved in keeping it going.
    Illegitimus non carborundum est

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mill Hall, Pennsylvania
    (Clinton County)
    Age
    32
    Posts
    1,246
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Quote Originally Posted by MARINE DIVISION TWO View Post
    Yeah that works well,Just Imagine needing your firearm in the event of a life or death struggle ? Not to mention a blank still has explosive capabilities so I am inclined to believe its still a loaded firearm unless disproved with a law citing and stating its not.
    How can anyone cite a law that says what is legal when laws only tell you what is illegal. Is there a law that says blanks are illegal or define what constitutes ammunition in regards to title 18 chapter 61?
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    μολ ν λαβέ
    What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms!

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    In the can, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Quote Originally Posted by Emptymag View Post
    Good deal. Always good to try to prevent people from breaking laws unknowingly, and/or hurting themselves unintentionally.

    I don't know what kind of blanks are used, but the 5.56 and 7.62x39 blanks I have don't have a projectile - just powder in a crimped off casing.
    I know that I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of the gas coming out of the barrel though - it's enough to propel a grenade several hundred feet, so I wouldn't consider it much safer than handling a rifle with a live round.
    Bruce Lee's son got himself killed on a movie set with a blank that propelled the dislodged bullet of a previously loaded dummy round still in the chamber.
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Chalfont, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Blanks are extremely dangerous at the muzzle end. I have been present for 3 blanks to the face of infantrymen in training.
    Luckily, no one died.

    I appreciate the honor guard- but if the guards can not be bothered or are physically incapable of loading and unloading a rifle it is probably time for them to retire.
    Crusader's local #556 South Central Asia chapter

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Levittown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    7,238
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Rifle is loaded with blank ammunition.

    Operative words, loaded, and ammunition. Very close proximity and alignment to a rifle blank discharge can inflict injury.

    Flip the question to a blank-firing pistol. How would one fare carrying a loaded blank (starter's) pistol if discovered by a nice police officer?
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mill Hall, Pennsylvania
    (Clinton County)
    Age
    32
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    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    The argument that a loaded gun is dangerous no matter what it's loaded with is a terrible argument. This was the same argument used against open carry at rally's. If a loaded gun is inherently dangerous and bad then carrying anything with a live cartridge is dangerous and bad and carrying +1 with a cartridge containing a projectile is super duper dangerous! What if the Honor Guard started using "firearms" as defined in 6102 like an AR pistol or something vs long arms? Would that suddenly be safer? What if they all carried Glocks with blanks in them to give their 21 gun salute? Would that be ok? Where is the line drawn with the question of safety? If they are handled in a safe matter what difference does it make?

    The OP's question was in regards to legality of blanks in a rifle in a vehicle. If there is a specific law against that then its settled. They should then keep them unloaded and load them at the cemetery (if taking a rifle to a cemetery with the intention of loading it is even legal) or maybe transport something that IS covered by a LTCF as defined in 6102. Garand pistols?
    Si vis pacem, para bellum
    μολ ν λαβέ
    What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms!

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Quakertown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    3,976
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    21474850

    Default Re: Live ammo VS. blanks and the law.

    Does the statute specify live ammunition or does it just say unloaded?

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