FFL transfer

[Bow2no1]

I told the guy I would pay the price. But I'm not paying for the transfer.
He wouldn't go for that... Deals lost over $25... Go figure

[Emptymag]

Over the years, I've made it a priority to only buy long guns FTF, and of the ones I bought at a shop in years prior to that decision, those long guns were the first to go when I needed to sell something to pay bills.

If we all took this approach, the gov would be even more screwed than they already are when it comes to knowing who owns what.

I'll offer to show someone my PA driver's license to satisfy the legal requirement that the sale is between two PA residents, and I'll offer to show my LTCF. I'll complete a bill of sale with both parties info if that's asked for.
I'll do without if they insist on a transfer. No hard feelings.
Some of the sellers knew me from the forum - some didn't know me from Adam - most were receptive to my offers of proof of residency and such, and most were content with the PA driver's license alone.

Other than handguns, I'm down to three that have a paper trail. If they want to know what I own, they have to troll the picture thread here. (not accurate by a long shot since several have been sold)
If they want to know what I own that I haven't posted pics of, they need a crystal ball - or a search warrant - or shovels - or scuba gear - or a forced confession via waterboarding.

[Sgt.K]

Would having an LTCF prohibit future illegal actions ?

Would a 4473?

Would a badge?

[SIGFAN86]

I told the guy I would pay the price. But I'm not paying for the transfer.
He wouldn't go for that... Deals lost over $25... Go figure

He will be hard pressed to find a buyer who will be willing to pay for a needless $30-50 fee. Will probably end up getting traded in or sold to a gun store to aswage his fears

[Bow2no1]

He will be hard pressed to find a buyer who will be willing to pay for a needless $30-50 fee. Will probably end up getting traded in or sold to a gun store to aswage his fears

That's what I'm figuring. A sale seems doubtful on his terms. I made by best attempt. That's all I have..

[Delkal]

I told the guy I would pay the price. But I'm not paying for the transfer.
He wouldn't go for that... Deals lost over $25... Go figure

What was the firearm and was it a fair asking price? Was this a $100 beater or a 500+ rifle?

You are making it sound like the seller was at fault. Did an extra $25 really put it in the outrageous price category? Or were you hell bent on not having it transferred to your name?

[abner13]

Unless the seller is the original retail purchaser , there is virtually no way to trace ownership of a long gun in PA.

[GunLawyer001]

One reason is that a transfer through a FFL would absolve the seller of all liabilities should the buyer use the firearm criminally or negligently. It would also absolve the seller of the possibility of selling it to a prohibited person.

True, there's explicit statutory immunity given to sellers who do a transfer through an FFL.

Maybe selling a $500 gun is worth a non-zero risk that you would be targeted for prosecution some day. It's a small risk, tiny even. ATF would have to recover the gun, do a forward trace from the factory to wholesaler to retailer; go to the first FFL, check his Bound Book, and if you were the buyer, then ATF has your name and address. They'd need evidence that you did something wrong, that you "should have known" something.

Getting caught in a criminal prosecution is expensive, even if you have a good lawyer and he makes it go away early. It's cripplingly expensive if you're prosecuted, and have to show that you were not negligent despite the DA's prima facie case that you sold a gun to a pedophile/kidnapper/spree shooter, or whatever.

Without an FFL transfer, the DA has to prove that you sold a gun to a prohibited person, or someone with evil intent. With an FFL transfer, you're immune. Is immunity worth $20 or $30 or $50? I dunno, that's your call. Some landlords allow pets, or smoking, but others don't. Shop around.

Would a prohibited person have a valid LTCF?

Sure. They don't vaporize when someone gets a PFA or conviction or is 302'd. They also get stolen from time to time, when a wallet is stolen. Plus there are things called "photocopiers".

Is demanding to see an LTCF a good practice when selling a long gun? Sure, it's some evidence of due care. But it's not bulletproof. At least 1 gun shop was crucified for selling handguns to a non-prohibited buyer who was approved by PICS every time, because "they should have known" that he didn't have the income or assets to buy so many guns, he was a straw buyer.

The anti's are obsessed and insane, much like the Terminator T-800 series. They will not stop until our guns are dead and gone, whether it's creating loopholes in the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Firearms Act, or by banning insurance for lawful gun use, or by blackmailing all banks to stop letting credit cards be used for guns, or whatever.

You may think you're selling a used shotgun to some fellow Pennsylvanian for $200. He may be wired, you may be the next "60 Minutes" segment, or Bloomberg may be sitting in the van down the street watching a grainy little pic of the sale.

I'm not urging anyone to do anything, I get paid when things go bad. I'm just suggesting a way to avoid that. Some FFL's will argue in favor of paying them $50 per gun to transfer a rifle or shotgun, and prohibited persons will encourage you to always do private sales or else "let your chains rest lightly upon you". Neither of them give a crap about you, or what you spend or what risks you take on.

[bigbob70]

AS a honest gun owner and an FFL, I feel for you but YOU COULD BE A LYING SCUMBAG THAT WANTS THE GUN TO TRANSFER TO A CONVICTED FELON SO THE SELLER WANTS YOUR INFO IN THE BOOKS SO THE ATF CAN COME AND KNOCK DOWN YOUR DOOR NOT HIS, sound right to you?

[Rosco the Iroc]

AS a honest gun owner and an FFL, I feel for you but YOU COULD BE A LYING SCUMBAG THAT WANTS THE GUN TO TRANSFER TO A CONVICTED FELON SO THE SELLER WANTS YOUR INFO IN THE BOOKS SO THE ATF CAN COME AND KNOCK DOWN YOUR DOOR NOT HIS, sound right to you?

WOW COOL 6th post bro