Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default PICS denial question

    Iíve been reading over tons of posts on here about PICS denials, and I wanted to share one that I experienced. And frankly, not one of the posts on here had the same situation as I did. So, to give you the background. I went to a gun store in Easton, where I plan to purchase a glock 17 for a duty weapon as I work as armored car guard. I filled out the paperwork and it ended up in research. About a week goes by and the store told me it was denied. I was shocked as Iíve never had that happen before. Oh, more about me I am a former LEO in Oklahoma and I know for a fact Iím not a prohibited person. Several years before I got into police work I had my run ins with the law, and have a misdemeanor conviction for breaking and entering( long story short I was drunk and walked into someone elseís apartment. In OK thatís up to a year in jail and $500 fine. And I also had a arrest for forgery (ex tried to pass off a stolen check and I wasnít involved) and the state declined the charges. That said, I ended up as a cop in the same state I had trouble in. Last time I purchased a gun was 15 years ago in OK, and was delayed 3 days and was eventually approved. Fast forward 15 years and I live in PA now. Iíve passed every background check as Iíve worked in security for almost 13 years. Iíve passed the check thru my employer. I applied (and was approved) for ACT 235. In fact Iím in the middle of the course as I write this. So my question is this: How can I have been approved for the 235 (which I passed both the PSP and FBI fingerprint checks) and PICS denied me? PICS is run by the PSP and the approval for the course came from them in the first place. Is one hand for the PSP not talking to the other? At any rate, I sent the challenge form in and Iím waiting to hear from them. I know Iím venting but I donít understand how they canít connect the dots. Iíve worked at two police departments in OK and they didnít have an issue. Iíve passed multiple BK checks and have never had a problem. Thoughts?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    ....misdemeanor conviction for breaking and entering( long story short I was drunk and walked into someone else’s apartment
    Sumpin wrong here. Sounds like a simple trespass. Why the breaking and entering? And how hard was it to get you out?

    Meanwhile, I guess you'll have to wait for the results of the filed challenge. Should that fail, it's probably time to hire an attorney astute in such things. (ahem).
    Last edited by Bang; April 9th, 2019 at 11:52 AM.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  3. #3
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    In Oklahoma there isnít a charge for trespass. Hell I didnít break anything I simply opened the back door of my apartment and heard yelling. I never entered either. And when I was questioned later by LE I stated that. In any event I was charged with that. I was young and dumb and the DA wanted to make an example out of me. At the time I couldnít afford legal counsel so I got the public defender. I ended up with a suspended sentence and I did seven weekends in jail. In any event, it never stopped me from becoming a LEO in the very same state.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    Yeah, my apologies. I just looked up OK (present-day) law. That's their lowest charge for such an occasion, apparently.

    I'm wondering if your PA state rep could be of help.

    I assume you are informed of the denial by nothing more than the FFL's phone contact? No document specifying the exact reason for the denial? Or what do you have? If no actual document, are you entitled to one, so you can challenge? How does that work?
    Last edited by Bang; April 9th, 2019 at 12:05 PM.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  5. #5
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    Oct 2006
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    Brookville, Pennsylvania
    (Jefferson County)
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    If you are in fact not prohibited, you will need to file the challenge form. HOWEVER, before doing so I'd consult with an attorney to make sure those Oklahoma things don't somehow prohibit you under PA law. PA's prohibitions is greater than federal law, not much, but it is.

    If you passed the ACT 235 background check, you should be good. But that isn't a guaranty.

    Sometimes PICS/NICS flags things because there was no resolution, sometimes because things look "iffy". A simple explanation in the challenge may clear that up.
    Last edited by knight0334; April 9th, 2019 at 03:35 PM. Reason: typos
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J.

    Don't end up in my signature!

  6. #6
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    When I was on the force I even had them run a III check on me and it showed the B and E and its disposition. I also saw the arrest on the forgery but I remember that the disposition was blank on that one. My guess is that the PICS system flagged it. But I purchased a firearm for work back then and it was delayed at first but then approved within 3 days. Oklahoma uses NICS so Iím pretty sure that the stateies here arenít connecting the dots probably.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    Do you have a PA LTCF? PICS denied mine once and when I went back a year later to reapply (somewhat of a long story) I had no problem and nothing had changed. The Sheriff related a story to me of how he was once denied a shotgun purchase for some reason of a glitch in the system so what has happened to you does and can happen. Sucks that you have to wade through it and do report how you make out.
    I know where Hunter's been.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    Iíve checked. Itís not a disqualification as itís a year or less. And my understanding of PA law is that itís usually for a violent offense. It would have been if it had been for B and E with intent to commit a crime, which my charge was not. As far as the arrest for the forgery goes the state declined to file charges. My guess is that the disposition being blank for that might be the problem. I answered the challenge form and wrote down what the charges were and their resolution.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    LOL!! Funny you ask, as I had applied for it the day before I went to buy the gun. I never thought that Iíd get a denial on PICS cuz I figured as I had already been approved for the 235 beforehand I thought I was in the clear as Iíd been vetted thru the state. So Iím sitting here scratching my head wondering what the hell is the PSP doing? LOL

  10. #10
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    Default Re: PICS denial question

    Quote Originally Posted by RobM1974 View Post
    LOL!! Funny you ask, as I had applied for it the day before I went to buy the gun. I never thought that I’d get a denial on PICS cuz I figured as I had already been approved for the 235 beforehand I thought I was in the clear as I’d been vetted thru the state. So I’m sitting here scratching my head wondering what the hell is the PSP doing? LOL
    In Berks County we walk out the door with our LTCF in about 15 minutes, not the same for you?
    I know where Hunter's been.

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