Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Mill Run, Pennsylvania
    (Fayette County)
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    It's possible that a 201 was converted to a 302 during the stay, but unlikely, the same way that a 302 is sometimes bumped up to a 303 with an additional hearing.

    Certainly worth trying to track down the truth, but if PICS knows about the inpatient stay, it's because the hospital mailed them a 302 commitment form. Nobody's enumerated rights should be stripped away because some clerk mailed off the wrong form.
    Nope have all the paperwork and the Doctors notes. His was never a 302 while in the hospital. Up until the time he signed the paper I had every right to drop the 302 complaint per the hospital. So if he didn't sign his 201 I would have dropped the 302 request.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    In the can, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by shamar100 View Post
    Nope have all the paperwork and the Doctors notes. His was never a 302 while in the hospital. Up until the time he signed the paper I had every right to drop the 302 complaint per the hospital. So if he didn't sign his 201 I would have dropped the 302 request.
    What you don't understand is that having the "paperwork" means nothing if your name is in a database somewhere.
    The people that make determinations are not going to correct the database no matter what paperwork you send them.

    It takes a lawyer to make them correct the database.
    It's not right or fair, but that's how it is across the board with guns or whatever else.

    Best to send GunLawyer an email and discuss your options with him: gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Initial consultations generally don't cost anything, and then you will know where you stand and what can be done about it.

    If you want to help your son, that's really the only way.
    Best of luck to you.
    Bern-
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Morgantown, Pennsylvania
    (Berks County)
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    If I remember correctly, you're not the first person on this forum to have a voluntary commitment end up on the 302 database. Somebody needs to sue the hospital for legal expenses when this happens so they actually pay attention to what they are doing, or stop doing it if it's intentional. There could be an individual on an ethical crusade filing 302s when they aren't supposed to because they don't like guns. It's unlikely, but I wouldn't be surprised.

    On a related note, I think the statute of limitations of civil action passed since the paperwork was 5 years ago. My question is, would the statute of limitations start from the actual "injury" of the pic denial or would it be from the date of act that set it into motion? Just curious.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Douglassville, Pennsylvania
    (Berks County)
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by giant_g2 View Post
    If I remember correctly, you're not the first person on this forum to have a voluntary commitment end up on the 302 database. Somebody needs to sue the hospital for legal expenses when this happens so they actually pay attention to what they are doing, or stop doing it if it's intentional. There could be an individual on an ethical crusade filing 302s when they aren't supposed to because they don't like guns. It's unlikely, but I wouldn't be surprised.

    On a related note, I think the statute of limitations of civil action passed since the paperwork was 5 years ago. My question is, would the statute of limitations start from the actual "injury" of the pic denial or would it be from the date of act that set it into motion? Just curious.
    I am not much in favor of all the lawsuits but this is one that I would see as justified.
    If it ain't broke it ain't mine.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Mill Run, Pennsylvania
    (Fayette County)
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Berncly View Post
    What you don't understand is that having the "paperwork" means nothing if your name is in a database somewhere.
    The people that make determinations are not going to correct the database no matter what paperwork you send them.

    It takes a lawyer to make them correct the database.
    It's not right or fair, but that's how it is across the board with guns or whatever else.

    Best to send GunLawyer an email and discuss your options with him: gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Initial consultations generally don't cost anything, and then you will know where you stand and what can be done about it.

    If you want to help your son, that's really the only way.
    Best of luck to you.
    Bern-
    Well here is what I found out this morning. Apparently we were lied to when this all went down. The mental health person at the time said that if we initially 302ed him to get him to the hospital then he had the option to sign himself in with a 201. This is exactly what we did. I talked with the same hospital today and they are giving me conflicting reports. One person tells me yes if he signed a 201 after being brought in then the 302 was null and void. Then another is saying that isn't the case at all. If we initially petitioned a 302 to get him to the hospital it didn't matter if he signed a 201 or not. The lady that handles this won't be back until the 18th for me to get other answers. I told them that isn't what anyone explained to me at the hospital otherwise we would have never 302ed him. I guess I need to start saving for a lawyer from how things are looking. Between this and paying for my daughters college this fall maybe I should just sign myself in ugh.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    In the can, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
    Posts
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    21474847

    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by shamar100 View Post
    Well here is what I found out this morning. Apparently we were lied to when this all went down. The mental health person at the time said that if we initially 302ed him to get him to the hospital then he had the option to sign himself in with a 201. This is exactly what we did. I talked with the same hospital today and they are giving me conflicting reports. One person tells me yes if he signed a 201 after being brought in then the 302 was null and void. Then another is saying that isn't the case at all. If we initially petitioned a 302 to get him to the hospital it didn't matter if he signed a 201 or not. The lady that handles this won't be back until the 18th for me to get other answers. I told them that isn't what anyone explained to me at the hospital otherwise we would have never 302ed him. I guess I need to start saving for a lawyer from how things are looking. Between this and paying for my daughters college this fall maybe I should just sign myself in ugh.
    Pennsylvania has been going after people who make mistakes on their gun purchase paperwork and get denied.
    You should contact GunLawyer without delay so that you are better prepared for whatever may come as a result.
    Bern-
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Mill Run, Pennsylvania
    (Fayette County)
    Posts
    9
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Berncly View Post
    Pennsylvania has been going after people who make mistakes on their gun purchase paperwork and get denied.
    You should contact GunLawyer without delay so that you are better prepared for whatever may come as a result.
    Bern-
    I've retained a lawyer in my area that handles alot of 2A issues. Gonna run me about 6 grand but it is what it is. I'm just disgusted the hospital told us one thing and then did another. My lawyer has told me he has seen this numerous times. So now my son has the lawyer's number in case we get a visit from the State Police looking for him. My lawyer advised my son to not say a word about the attempted purchase and to give him his name and phone number so they can be referred to my lawyer.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Douglassville, Pennsylvania
    (Berks County)
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by shamar100 View Post
    I've retained a lawyer in my area that handles alot of 2A issues. Gonna run me about 6 grand but it is what it is. I'm just disgusted the hospital told us one thing and then did another. My lawyer has told me he has seen this numerous times. So now my son has the lawyer's number in case we get a visit from the State Police looking for him. My lawyer advised my son to not say a word about the attempted purchase and to give him his name and phone number so they can be referred to my lawyer.
    Did he give you a timeline? I'll bet it's up to six years. Please do update how it goes and good luck getting it taken care of.
    If it ain't broke it ain't mine.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    In the can, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
    Posts
    2,211
    Rep Power
    21474847

    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by shamar100 View Post
    I've retained a lawyer in my area that handles alot of 2A issues. Gonna run me about 6 grand but it is what it is. I'm just disgusted the hospital told us one thing and then did another. My lawyer has told me he has seen this numerous times. So now my son has the lawyer's number in case we get a visit from the State Police looking for him. My lawyer advised my son to not say a word about the attempted purchase and to give him his name and phone number so they can be referred to my lawyer.
    It would be a good idea to email GunLawyer and ask him if he knows your lawyer and if he has any opinion about him.
    He can give you his recommendation to stay with your guy or to possibly go with another name on your side of the state.
    Many of us know Phil (GunLawyer) personally, and know him to be an honest and very knowledgeable gun rights attorney.
    Where I in your shoes I would want his input on my selection.
    Bern-
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Mill Run, Pennsylvania
    (Fayette County)
    Posts
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    Default Re: Another 302 Question

    Quote Originally Posted by Berncly View Post
    It would be a good idea to email GunLawyer and ask him if he knows your lawyer and if he has any opinion about him.
    He can give you his recommendation to stay with your guy or to possibly go with another name on your side of the state.
    Many of us know Phil (GunLawyer) personally, and know him to be an honest and very knowledgeable gun rights attorney.
    Where I in your shoes I would want his input on my selection.
    Bern-
    It is the guy who runs http://www.pagunlaws.com There were only a few in my general area that handle this situation.

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