Magpul Exec. Duane Liptak open letter about the NRA

[GunLawyer001]

But how does one fight the slow crawl to politically no guns should be allowed? I mean, at some point, the pot will boil over.

Not by destroying our most effective lobbying organization, that's for sure. That turns the "slow crawl" into a "rapid plummet", which is only good news for the Lefties and those allegedly "on our side" who want to watch the world burn. The UK has no NRA. Or guns.

America is changing, the Dems are importing tens of millions of 3rd World residents who are poorly educated and not big on "rules", so they tolerate crooks like Hillary and Menendez, and they believe implicitly that government exists to take money from rich people and hand it to less productive large families.

I'm not sure that we can fight that trend, urban areas filled with fairly unintelligent groups are going to vote for the bigger-govt Dems every time; what would it take for Philadelphia in 2020 to vote for Trump, or any Republican, instead of for whomever their "community leaders" tell them to vote?

[wanneroo]

I agree with that. My complaint is about those who falsely claim that the NRA keeps supporting more restrictions on gun rights, when the reality is that the NRA aims to strike a balance between what we deserve under the Constitution and what is possible given today's politics. No member of Congress is going to stand up and demand that it be easier for the mentally ill to get guns, or argue that people need machineguns for home defense (I know it's not about "needs", but try to embrace the reality.) The constituency for "any guns for anybody" is tiny, the political cost for the attempt is fatal.

We can't even get deregulated silencers, in a country that mandates mufflers on cars. If OSHA were in charge, silencers would be mandatory, at least for police and security guards who use guns at work. But there's no political leverage to get it.

Look, a perfect bicycle would weigh zero pounds, but in the real world you just get the lightest one you can afford. I have no idea what perfect gun legislation would be, we don't even agree about that here on a gun forum, where some of you favor letting felons go right from the prison to a gun shop after their 20 year sentence for triple homicide is over, and others think that there are some (kids, violent criminals, the dangerously mentally ill, illegal aliens) who shouldn't be unsupervised and shouldn't have access to weapons. The NRA can't possibly be 100% in sync with all gun owners. They're just more effective than any other organization except for AARP and the ABA.

I don't have any expectation that the NRA will support 100% of what I want, nor any other party or organization.

What concerns me is where does this compromising stop? There seems to be a train of thought that these continued concessions and horse trading are going to ward off left wing wackos who want it all. The democratic party is pretty much out of the closet as full blown communists and totalitarians and some seem to think that if we keep feeding them pieces of the pie we'll have more pie. We see it now with states with already existing magazine restrictions passing more magazine restrictions. Once one thing is handed over, they want more. Have a look at Australia, everyone got bent over a barrel in 1998 and 2002 and yet the state governments there just keep attacking gun owners. Toy gel blasters have just been declared a "firearm" in New South Wales. This seems to be the path we are on. I want an organization that pushes back not just manages the decline.

[GunLawyer001]

. . . I want an organization that pushes back not just manages the decline.

When you find one that manages to successfully do that every time, let me know. Nobody wins 100% every time, not Dems or Republicans or even AARP, so let's all manage our expectations like true conservatives and focus on what's possible in a country that's half Hillary voters.

[fallenleader]

i think the real solution to this problem is to so overwhelmingly flood society with guns that they become impossible to regulate.
just look at how well the 50 year drug war solved the rEeFeR mAdnEsS!!!!1
iirc, just saw that there was enough fentanyl seized last year to kill every single American, even the communists and pseudo-Americans.

a gun in everyone's [no exceptions] hand has been tried at various scales with sucess, certainly more evidence that in time it creates a polite and safe society than there is evidence that socialism creates a bountiful utopia. hopefully 3d printing & machining quality and pricing catches up sooner rather than later.
when ownership of piece of equipment that can easily produce a moderate quality firearm with little more effort than any other hobby becomes commonplace, all attempts to regulate become moot.

then we'll be too busy not making our own guns AND too busy not reloading.

[gghbi]

i think the real solution to this problem is to so overwhelmingly flood society with guns that they become impossible to regulate.

By chance do you have stock in PSA? That seems to be their approach, God bless 'em.

[Bang]

The trend to control "guns" has been incrementally expanding in protracted fashion, each time riding the waves heightened by selective import on the part of MSM and politicians alert for opportunity.

Attempting to look ahead and contemplating the unthinkable, what citizen reaction can be envisioned here in the USA should federal government take the Australian approach to gun control? And....considering today's electronic realities and warpings of civil rights, dare it be discussed in open forum?

[GunLawyer001]

The trend to control "guns" has been incrementally expanding in protracted fashion, each time riding the waves heightened by selective import on the part of MSM and politicians alert for opportunity.

Attempting to look ahead and contemplating the unthinkable, what citizen reaction can be envisioned here in the USA should federal government take the Australian approach to gun control? And....considering today's electronic realities and warpings of civil rights, dare it be discussed in open forum?

The urge to control people is not new, the 1934 NFA was originally intended to ban all handguns. That 1934 law came after the failed Prohibition experiment, where the whiny Temperance folks finally got their way and banned alcohol from around 1919-1933.

For centuries, some people thought they had the right to control what gods you prayed to (now they just file lawsuits to get those manger scenes out of the public squares).

If you add up all the efforts to control what people see and what they read and the porn they can view and the cars they can drive and the lightbulbs they can buy and the toilets they can flush and when they can spank their kids and how fast they can drive and how much alcohol can be in their blood . . . and a billion other micro-management goals of a majority of humans, then "gun control" starts to make sense as their additional goal.

If you think that you have the right to stone infidels or seize somebody's property because you have a better use for it, then yeah, it would be discouraging if the sheep could look up and fight back. Silence their websites and seize their weapons, control the words they may use, seize their kids and abuse the classrooms for your political goals, all the better to enslave them.

[fallenleader]

By chance do you have stock in PSA? That seems to be their approach, God bless 'em.

no, but i agree. i've got some of their stuff if that counts as "stock" the problem is we need more new buyers instead of more repeat buyers.
or someone needs to johnny appleseed liberators like candy canes at christmas time.
the stamped ones, not the printed ones that kill the user.

[57springer]

I agree with that. My complaint is about those who falsely claim that the NRA keeps supporting more restrictions on gun rights, when the reality is that the NRA aims to strike a balance between what we deserve under the Constitution and what is possible given today's politics. No member of Congress is going to stand up and demand that it be easier for the mentally ill to get guns, or argue that people need machineguns for home defense (I know it's not about "needs", but try to embrace the reality.) The constituency for "any guns for anybody" is tiny, the political cost for the attempt is fatal.

We can't even get deregulated silencers, in a country that mandates mufflers on cars. If OSHA were in charge, silencers would be mandatory, at least for police and security guards who use guns at work. But there's no political leverage to get it.

Look, a perfect bicycle would weigh zero pounds, but in the real world you just get the lightest one you can afford. I have no idea what perfect gun legislation would be, we don't even agree about that here on a gun forum, where some of you favor letting felons go right from the prison to a gun shop after their 20 year sentence for triple homicide is over, and others think that there are some (kids, violent criminals, the dangerously mentally ill, illegal aliens) who shouldn't be unsupervised and shouldn't have access to weapons. The NRA can't possibly be 100% in sync with all gun owners. They're just more effective than any other organization except for AARP and the ABA.

Shall not be infringed 17258d1399070658-loosing-faith-hp-imageuploadedbyhi-point-forum1399070655_571213.jpg

[unclejumbo]

Shall not be infringed 17258d1399070658-loosing-faith-hp-imageuploadedbyhi-point-forum1399070655_571213.jpg

And what have you done since it clearly has been infringed. Have you started shooting at the tyrants? If not, why are you compromising, why are you willing to accept things as they are? Because everyone does a cost/benefit analysis, even about supposedly unassailable rights. We all compromise but vilify the NRA for supposedly compromising.

The most humorous are those in NY, NJ, CA et al that rail against the ineffective NRA while continuing to live in and pay taxes to a state that has raped them in regards to their 2A rights. They always have "reasons" why paying their tyrants is in their best interest, get mad at those that have moved away for more favorable conditions and bitch, bitch, bitch about their misfortune.

Shall not be infringed is a great T-shirt slogan, an applause getter at rallies and conventions and something not one of us practices in reality.