Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #11
    Join Date
    May 2012
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    Yardley, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Please ask them how this will make a difference and have your facts that it will not... Example :67% of gun violence stats are suicide and we have lower suicide rates than Japan, France and Iceland. 18% of so called gun violence is police and self defense... Used much more 8n self defense than criminal use. Then finally of the final 15%, 85% of those killings are drug and gangs in strict gun control cities of Chicago, LA, Oakland, Baltimore, trenton, etc. We're at 1940s levels of so called gun violence.

    Wish I could be there, these people will do what they want but the hate being put on the spot. Come with facts especially on pre emotion. They'll try to say the courts ruled pre emotion was Unconstitutional, but it was only over turned because it was attached to a scrap bill. Good luck and press them with numerous questions.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
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    Perry County, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    May want to take the legal definition of a municipality, as well.

    My first thought was, ‘well... are cities considered municipalities?’. A quick search online leads me to believe that municipalities include cities, buroughs, townships and incorporated towns.

    Just thinking this may be their MO to try to get it passed.

    Wish I could attend, but I’m 3 hours away. Keep fighting the good fight gents.

    Best of luck,
    Bilky

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Yes, a city, borough and township are all types of municipalities.

    Philly gets special treatment due to their size. Pittsburgh does not.
    Psalms 73:26

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Chippewa, Pennsylvania
    (Beaver County)
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Pittsburgh has a Home Rule Charter.

    http://apps.pittsburghpa.gov/citycle..._home_rule.pdf



    As such, and in my "not a lawyer" opinion, then Title 52 Section 2962(g) makes it even more clear that Pittsburgh has no right to do this.

    ""(g) Regulation of firearms.--A municipality shall not enact
    any ordinance or take any other action dealing with the
    regulation of the transfer, ownership, transportation or
    possession of firearms.""

    2962 is restrictions on Home Rule.

    https://www.legis.state.pa.us/WU01/L.../PDF/53/53.PDF



    I don't know how Pittsburgh think it is on solid legal ground, unless they're counting on the democratic supreme court to overturn BOTH preemptions in the statutes. The home rule aspect caught my ear yesterday, when I was up near the entrance of the city building and overheard someone on the cities side talking about home rule wording being a work around 6201.

    I just don't see it since home rule limitations also preempt firearm regulation.
    Life has a melody.

  5. #15
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    Feb 2018
    Location
    Perry County, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    So a city of the First Class would be it’s own entity, separate and different from a municipality? Would that be a correct assumption?

    Sounds odd, especially being under the same Commonwealth of all the other towns, cities, townships, etc.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Pittsburgh-South Hills, Pennsylvania
    (Allegheny County)
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Quote Originally Posted by Bilky View Post
    So a city of the First Class would be it’s own entity, separate and different from a municipality? Would that be a correct assumption?

    Sounds odd, especially being under the same Commonwealth of all the other towns, cities, townships, etc.
    A city of the first class is still a municipality, but is granted certain exemptions and additional powers.

    And Philly is the only city that ever was or ever will be "first class" in PA. No way Pittsburgh reaches 1MM people, and if PGH did, legislators from the East side of the state would push to amend the definition to exclude PGH.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Southwest, Pennsylvania
    (Washington County)
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Quote Originally Posted by JustinHEMI View Post
    Pittsburgh has a Home Rule Charter.

    http://apps.pittsburghpa.gov/citycle..._home_rule.pdf



    As such, and in my "not a lawyer" opinion, then Title 52 Section 2962(g) makes it even more clear that Pittsburgh has no right to do this.

    ""(g) Regulation of firearms.--A municipality shall not enact
    any ordinance or take any other action dealing with the
    regulation of the transfer, ownership, transportation or
    possession of firearms.""

    2962 is restrictions on Home Rule.

    https://www.legis.state.pa.us/WU01/L.../PDF/53/53.PDF



    I don't know how Pittsburgh think it is on solid legal ground, unless they're counting on the democratic supreme court to overturn BOTH preemptions in the statutes. The home rule aspect caught my ear yesterday, when I was up near the entrance of the city building and overheard someone on the cities side talking about home rule wording being a work around 6201.

    I just don't see it since home rule limitations also preempt firearm regulation.
    I don't think they believe they have a legal case and I don't believe they will attempt to enforce these ordinances, once passed. I believe they are trying to form a coalition of local governments who will pass similar illegal ordinances, and to use that precedent to then lobby the state legislature to repeal preemption. I believe this is their play.

    They want to be able to say: "we have laws on the books that could have prevented this, but the state won't let us enforce them."
    Last edited by marinville; January 8th, 2019 at 12:20 PM.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    Chippewa, Pennsylvania
    (Beaver County)
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Quote Originally Posted by marinville View Post
    I don't think they believe they have a legal case and I don't believe they will attempt to enforce these ordinances, once passed. I believe they are trying to form a coalition of local governments who will pass similar illegal ordinances, and to use that precedent to then lobby the state legislature to repeal preemption. I believe this is their play.

    Gotcha, thanks!
    Life has a melody.

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Northern Tier, Pennsylvania
    (McKean County)
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    51
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Quote Originally Posted by marinville View Post
    I don't think they believe they have a legal case and I don't believe they will attempt to enforce these ordinances, once passed. I believe they are trying to form a coalition of local governments who will pass similar illegal ordinances, and to use that precedent to then lobby the state legislature to repeal preemption. I believe this is their play.

    They want to be able to say: "we have laws on the books that could have prevented this, but the state won't let us enforce them."
    Yup.
    Which is why Wolf is encouraging it.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
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    Default Re: ***Pittsburgh City Council, 1/24/19, 1800 (6PM)***

    Quote Originally Posted by PA_Robert View Post
    I can do 6:00 PM in Pittsburgh.

    I'll bring four items:
    • Pocket US Constitution
    • PA State Constitution (with Article 1 section 21 highlighted)
    • UFA Section 6120 (a)
    • Legal definition of Preemption


    I am quite certain that you will have to leave those in the "drop off box", I am quite certain that the Pittsburgh City Council do that all the time.

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