Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #71
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by spacemanvic View Post
    And the official hammer drop. Advance to 7:59 for the announcement.

    This might have been mentioned, but I have not done reading all the pages. What you copied was a live stream not a video. There is nothing there anymore.
    IANAL MPMO VIVA CUBA LIBRE

  2. #72
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by spacemanvic View Post
    I wouldn’t take that bet. NFA 34 and 68 kind of casts a cloud on the assessment of the courts. I just wish Trump wasn’t trying so hard to be a Hillary or a Kamala. He’s playing right into the hands of the Democrats and leaving us out to dry.
    I would take that bet. Not on 2nd Amendment grounds, but maybe on a "takings" argument, or a "separation of powers" argument.

    The bump stock doesn't alter the trigger, and unlike the Akins device there's no mechanical spring to obviate the need for directed muscle control. For every shot, your arm needs to adapt and supply a changing amount of pressure; for proof, try to rapidly fire the bump stock one-handed.

    The statute doesn't support the EO, it would be up to Congress to alter the statute to achieve this outcome. I suspect that Trump knows this, so he gets the credit for "doing something" without any lasting harm, and he takes the wind out of the sails of the anti's.

    This doesn't require a particularly pro-2nd Amendment court, it just requires capable lawyers who provide the factual evidence that this top-down directive to "re-define" the mechanism is at odds with reality.

    The problem we face in any absolutist jihad is that most of the country has been brainwashed, and we honestly don't have the votes at the polls or in courts to sustain a platform of "everybody gets whatever guns they want, from birth to the day they get out of prison on that murder conviction". You'd have a better chance making Christmas a national holiday in Iran.

    Even the Heller decision provides some wiggle room to ban particularly dangerous and unusual weapons, and we don't have a stockpile of self-defense stories where a bump stock would have saved a family of Mormons from a gang of ruthless cartel assassins. I understand the philosophy of "I can do anything I want and I will never compromise my rights", just like I understand the intent of a mouse in an aquarium with a python that it would prefer not to be eaten. If 2 mice are in there, and one says "I'm tunneling out before I get eaten" and the other says "I shouldn't have to run away, I have a right to live!", guess which one has the better chance of surviving.

    We don't have the votes on our side. We don't have the laws on our side. We don't have most of the courts on our side. And some of that is because of extremists who could have voted for weak Republicans who would have won instead letting actively hostile Democrats win. Thanks to you, our courts had 8 years under Obama and 8 years under Clinton to veer Leftward, and it took a miracle and a "compromising lawyer" to get us the Heller decision.

    Even General Patton compromised, he never just went balls-to-the-walls against every enemy, he evaluated the terrain and he adapted. Be like George Patton, not like George Custer, who refused to compromise and lost everything.
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ungawa's M16A1 is for sale, see the NFA ads! http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.ph...06#post3835606

  3. #73
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by Manxdriver View Post
    This is my first thoughts on the subject. I think there might be a brillianc3 to this EO. Make an illegal order, and force the Courts to say it is illegal. Then it is settled. Not even the stupid Occasional-Cortex bimbo wants to draft a law that the Supremes are l8kely to use as a clay pigeon.
    I honestly believe this is what is happening but I still wouldn't mind seeing the view from the hill.

  4. #74
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    The approach is always a short-sighted singular focus. If they don't like what the bump stock produces, they should outlaw any device that duplicates or nearly duplicates the rate of fire of a fully automatic sub machine gun (or exceeds the fastest known semi-auto rate of fire) and be done with it....except the argument of how many rounds per minute will be allowed.

    Then enterprising inventors can design devices that count shots fired within xx time, with a read-out of xxx per minute equivalent to enforce the law. Subject to BATFE approval, of course.

  5. #75
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Is this poofa?

    Spare me the 4D chess shit again. Trump is not a friend. Stop being NPCs.




    Compromise. No. Shan't.
    Life has a melody.

  6. #76
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by God's Country View Post
    Gun owners only agenda is to always suck up small nibbles around the edges. Kick up a fuss, and keep voting for Rino's because the dems are worse.
    It's a losing strategy, it's not even a strategy. It's an acceptance of the inevitable, kicking the can for as long as possible. That's it.
    That's all we got. I have yet to ever here a coherent, executable plan to reverse the direction of gun control.

    As a group we're a joke. We have shown time and time again that we will always crawl back to our masters and cut down any that decent. The RNC treats us no different than the DNC treats minorities. We're an important voting block with no backbone. So we get tossed away the day after the election.

    Any of this sound familiar?

    Trump is a turncoat, and worse he's doing the work that the DNC couldn't accomplish.
    I don't give one flying fuck if only one person owns a bump stock.
    Throwing that person(s) under the bus accomplishes nothing.
    Where' s the great compromise?
    As usual we lose ground and gain absolutely nothing in return.
    We can't even point to some lame ass victory to offset the loss.....as has become the norm.

    If the only reason a gun owner can justify voting for Trump is because the other person will do .... then go ahead vote for Trump. I really don't care.
    But don't pretend your vote is cast better than any other. You're just doing what we have all been doing for decades, while slowly and quietly losing, and enriching the NRA. They have no fucking clue ( or dare I say desire) to turn the tide on eventual gun confiscation.

    First time in my life anything firearm related has been effectively confiscated. And it was done by a scumbag RINO POTUS by fiat.
    There are no more excuses to be made. He made the decree, and is now acting on it.
    Making criminals out of people that own what amounts to a plastic toy.

    I've lost sleep, my voice, plenty of money, and who knows how much of my life fighting this shit. Most of it for nothing, and I'm still waiting to hear a winning strategy.
    It won't be today, tomorrow, or ever, because it's quite obvious we (as a group) just don't want it. It's either too hard, too far gone, or was never going to happen because there is no magic pill. Kicking money to a lobbying group to do all the dirty work will only get you shit on, laughed at, and quickly forgotten.

    It's obvious that must be what we want. Far more than freedom. Its' just too much damn work, and the relying on those that will work hard has run it's course.

    Now it really is on us. Each and every one of us.
    Two main problems gun rights voters have is not all gun owners vote pro gun or vote at all. We depend on the GOP whose not always pro second amendment. In addition to that third part candidates rarely win.

    From what I saw one of the characteristics that caused Bill, Clinton, Obama and trump to possessed to win was they were all able to create a “rock star “ image. Thankfully Hillary was unable to do so and neither was Jeb Bush or John Kasick both who the GOP cronies heavily favored.

    My point is if a third party candidate is solidly pro gun rights, has answers to other political issues and most importantly as the traits to create a “rock star” image it just might work. However it’s a long shot.

    In the meantime if the democrats take the house senate and white house the only thing stopping complete gun bans is the supreme court; and that’s no guarantee.

  7. #77
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    Feb 2011
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    etters, Pennsylvania
    (York County)
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
    Well GOA is suing and I am contributing.

    The NRA I expect to sit on their ass and do nothing.
    Yep. I wouldn't be surprised to find out the NRA signed off on it. No mention of this news on their website. Sold us out again.

    I kept telling people Trump was no gun rights supporter during the campaign. Figured he would go after something, just didn't know what.

  8. #78
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by JustinHEMI View Post
    Is this poofa?

    Spare me the 4D chess shit again. Trump is not a friend. Stop being NPCs.

    . . .
    You want to be really careful about the name-calling.
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ungawa's M16A1 is for sale, see the NFA ads! http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.ph...06#post3835606

  9. #79
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Wow.

  10. #80
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    Default Re: Bump Stock ban Rule in Place

    Quote Originally Posted by eagleclaw View Post
    Two main problems gun rights voters have is not all gun owners vote pro gun or vote at all. We depend on the GOP whose not always pro second amendment. In addition to that third part candidates rarely win.

    From what I saw one of the characteristics that caused Bill, Clinton, Obama and trump to possessed to win was they were all able to create a “rock star “ image. Thankfully Hillary was unable to do so and neither was Jeb Bush or John Kasick both who the GOP cronies heavily favored.

    My point is if a third party candidate is solidly pro gun rights, has answers to other political issues and most importantly as the traits to create a “rock star” image it just might work. However it’s a long shot.

    In the meantime if the democrats take the house senate and white house the only thing stopping complete gun bans is the supreme court; and that’s no guarantee.
    Building on this idea, all I see is playing the long game. Vote 3rd party until the GOP gets the messages and becomes solidly pro gun & pro liberty.

    But I have no illusions. Won't happen.

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