Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #61
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    Sep 2010
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by Didnotcomply89 View Post
    In a conversation with another gun owner today, he declared that if anyone needs more than five shots to end a threat then they have a big problem, as in the big problem is that you are incompetent, and that no one 'needs' 30 round magazines or 'assault weapons' (common sporting rifles). Your thoughts? is there truth to the statement? ignorance? I withhold my opinion until I hear some thoughts from the community. I don't mean for this to turn into a flame war. I want to gather insight from other people that I recognize at least know half of what they are talking about, at minimum.

    Thanks.
    i carry 45 rounds, does he really want to tell me how to freedom?
    truth being, i don't need any of them, we all know that simply displaying a firearm makes criminals drop to the ground and cry.
    if only i could get a glock that could rack like a 12ga, women's panties would fly off.
    There is no way to make it out alive...

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
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    Bala Cynwyd, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    A cousin of mine, who is an ardent 2A supporter and carries daily, told me that according to research almost all civilian gunfights are done in six shots or less, so he doesn't carry more than that and thinks it's stupid to carry more.

    I can't call him a fudd knowing his stance on MSRs and other things, but I do think he's wrong on his carry approach.

    So long as it doesn't translate into "let's ban mags above six rounds" I honestly don't care.

  3. #63
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    Dec 2006
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    Bucks, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by bluetrane2028 View Post
    A cousin of mine, who is an ardent 2A supporter and carries daily, told me that according to research almost all civilian gunfights are done in six shots or less, so he doesn't carry more than that and thinks it's stupid to carry more.

    I can't call him a fudd knowing his stance on MSRs and other things, but I do think he's wrong on his carry approach.

    So long as it doesn't translate into "let's ban mags above six rounds" I honestly don't care.
    Almost every car trip ends without requiring seat belts or air bags. So what?
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ce sac n'est pas un jouet.

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Glockin, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by bluetrane2028 View Post
    A cousin of mine, who is an ardent 2A supporter and carries daily, told me that according to research almost all civilian gunfights are done in six shots or less, so he doesn't carry more than that and thinks it's stupid to carry more.

    I can't call him a fudd knowing his stance on MSRs and other things, but I do think he's wrong on his carry approach.

    So long as it doesn't translate into "let's ban mags above six rounds" I honestly don't care.
    The difference there is "I feel fine carrying 6 rounds" vs "no one should be able to carry more than 6 rounds".

  5. #65
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    Dec 2012
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    Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    (Philadelphia County)
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by esh21167 View Post
    Ask him if police need more than 5 rounds. If so, why?
    Yes. Because sometimes it’s hard to hit a moving dog with less than five rounds.

  6. #66
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    Nov 2013
    Location
    Erie (Harborcreek), Pennsylvania
    (Erie County)
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by streaker69 View Post
    I would say if you need more than 1 shot you're a problem. One Shot, One Kill.
    So, if you are confronted by two home invaders, do you call time out, and have them stand one behind the other?

  7. #67
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    Dec 2012
    Location
    Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    (Philadelphia County)
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    I haven't heard anyone who favors limiting guns to 10 or 7 rounds, who thinks that's a good idea for cops, too.

    There aren't 2 different sets of bad guys out there. We encounter the exact same bad guys as cops do. If cops need 15 or 20 rounds, with a loaded AR-15 in the trunk just in case, then we probably do as well. Because cops aren't the primary prey of bad guys, we are. Cops almost always have advance notice of the situation into which they are sent, we almost never do (in fact, if you're told 5 minutes ahead of time that there's an armed threat a mile away, and you go there, your defenses are reduced in court.)
    Actually, lately, we have been the primary prey. And not because they interfered with them committing a crime, but simply because they were cops.

    I have no issue with law abiding folks having large capacity magazines for their self defense. Lately in Philadelphia the bad guys must have discovered the extended Glock magazines, because we have had shootings with mag dumps of over 30 rounds 9mm and 22 rounds of .40 S&W on shooting scenes.

    And there is a little difference with the police and weapons for civilian self defense. While extended magazines should be normal carry for your self defense, you don’t normally switch into a hunter mode and aggressively track down assailants. The police aren’t better, just different.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    127.0.0.1, Pennsylvania
    (Lancaster County)
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by SevenMilePete View Post
    So, if you are confronted by two home invaders, do you call time out, and have them stand one behind the other?
    Yes, see post #39.

    Rules are written in the stone,
    Break the rules and you get no bones,
    all you get is ridicule, laughter,
    and a trip to the house of pain.

  9. #69
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    Dec 2006
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    Bucks, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by Carson View Post
    Actually, lately, we have been the primary prey. And not because they interfered with them committing a crime, but simply because they were cops.

    I have no issue with law abiding folks having large capacity magazines for their self defense. Lately in Philadelphia the bad guys must have discovered the extended Glock magazines, because we have had shootings with mag dumps of over 30 rounds 9mm and 22 rounds of .40 S&W on shooting scenes.

    And there is a little difference with the police and weapons for civilian self defense. While extended magazines should be normal carry for your self defense, you don’t normally switch into a hunter mode and aggressively track down assailants. The police aren’t better, just different.
    I agree that cops have the extra duty of aggressively tracking down assailants. But they aren't firing rounds into every nook and cranny as they do so; at some point, they encounter an armed bad guy and at that point the physical dynamic looks a lot like a homeowner fighting off a home invader.

    The fact that many shootings by police seem to involve 3 or 4 officers all emptying their guns into the suspect, is a topic for another day.

    As for cops being the primary prey of bad guys, I'd word that differently. Most criminals target non-police for their robberies and rapes and kidnappings and sport beatings. A relatively few animals will sneak up on cops and assassinate them as they sit in their cars, or call them to a scene and gun them down from cover. Doesn't seem like most of these cops get a chance to shoot back at all, much less use up a limited capacity magazine in the process.

    We ultimately agree, though, that law-abiding Americans (cops or not) should have the best chance to fight back and survive a gun fight. With an increasing frequency of semi-armed mobs rampaging and hitting people and burning stuff and dragging the innocent out of their cars, we only encourage them if we have ineffectual pea-shooters holding 5 or 6 rounds, or even 10. What police discovered decades ago, and remains true, is that a display of overwhelming force will prevent the violence from occurring at all. A gang of 20 thugs carrying baseball bats might rush you with your S&W Airweight, and you'll kill a few of them and they'll beat you to death; but pull out a 15 round Glock and they may scurry away with nobody getting hurt.
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ce sac n'est pas un jouet.

  10. #70
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    Sep 2018
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    Pittsburgh - with an H, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: "Anything more than five rounds and you are a problem"

    Quote Originally Posted by Carson View Post
    Actually, lately, we have been the primary prey.
    If that was true, there wouldn't be a cop left.

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