A very good theory on the rash of school shootings

**Gun** · May 26th, 2018, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by bravo30

i still think if the media stops reporting them, they go away.

Teenage suicide is far more prevalent than school shootings, not reported much in the news.

Suicide is a serious public health problem that affects many young people. Suicide is the third leading cause of death for youth between the ages of 10 and 24, and results in approximately 4,600 lives lost each year.

Deaths from youth suicide are only part of the problem. More young people survive suicide attempts than actually die. A nationwide survey of high school students in the United States found that 16% of students reported seriously considering suicide, 13% reported creating a plan, and 8% reporting trying to take their own life in the 12 months preceding the survey. Each year, approximately 157,000 youth between the ages of 10 and 24 are treated Emergency Departments across the U.S. for self-inflicted injuries.

https://www.cdc.gov/healthcommunicat...cideYouth.html

**unclejumbo** · May 26th, 2018, 12:58 PM

Originally Posted by Tacgunner

The shooters have made a cognitive choice to perform their actions. They decided, for whatever reasons, to do this act. They planned and performed it. Working backwards, what compelled, motivated or drove them to this decision? Why was this their choice of things to do? Why perform a "shooting" instead of some other action?

Was it peer pressure, drugs, bullying, dysfunctional family, social media, mental illness or societal pressures? I'm not buying the "herd mentality" reason. Someone, whose job it is to write "profiles", knows what makes up these people, what sets them up & sets them off. It would be handy to know what the benchmarks, or parameters, are that we all should be looking for in certain people. What are the "signs" of such an "at risk" person?

We do know that the school shootings are focused on one thing: the school, or what it contains or embodies. The target is either the facility, the students, the staff, or the whole embodiment of the "school" as an entity. All the hate, aggression and willful terror is focused on that. Question is: why, and specifically who/what at the school?

Is it simply that the whole "school" environment has become too pressurized and toxic to some people that they snap and do these shootings as a way to express their mental anguish being trapped in this environment, with no escape other than destruction?

This article goes back to a decades old theory in law enforcement called the "broken windows" theory. It's an established psychological phenomenon. We see it in riots, looting and other criminal activities. Once the first person acts, others find it more acceptable to act as well. These kids aren't bullied to the point of losing their minds, they're angry and committing murder to show others their anger. Look at the last two, not suicidal in Cruz's case, chickened out of suicide in Pagourtzis' case. It's just becoming more mainstream to shoot up your school if you're angry...an airing of grievances if you will.

**Gun** · May 26th, 2018, 01:01 PM

Originally Posted by unclejumbo

This article goes back to a decades old theory in law enforcement called the "broken windows" theory. It's an established psychological phenomenon. We see it in riots, looting and other criminal activities. Once the first person acts, others find it more acceptable to act as well. These kids aren't bullied to the point of losing their minds, they're angry and committing murder to show others their anger. Look at the last two, not suicidal in Cruz's case, chickened out of suicide in Pagourtzis' case. It's just becoming more mainstream to shoot up your school if you're angry...an airing of grievances if you will.

Same thing back in the 60's and 70's, peaceful protesters and radical protesters.

**Tacgunner** · May 26th, 2018, 02:57 PM

I can't place all my bets on the "broken windows" answer to this. In those cases that don't end in a suicidal outcome, okay, I'll concede. But it seems the lean more toward anguish, existential despair and existential nihilism for at least half of these shootings. Yeah, I know it sounds "deep think" stuff. Look up the signs of those and it looks like something teenagers, in present day, would end up feeling if mentally bullied by peers and the "system".

People who feel they have "no future" lash out. Fed a diet of End Of The World type videos and movies, some are going to feel anguish and no future, feeling trapped in a doomed world with nothing for them. They are told they are "Zeros" and are going to snap if they see no signs of a better future for them. They are the "Beaten Dogs" who eventually bite.

Unresponsive parents, digital only friends, prison style schools, and the normal stresses of teenage life, all compress these kids until they break. I do not hold them blameless. There are no excuses for their actions: there are reasons for the outcomes. Every single person who had meaningful contact with these shooters, before they snapped, had some form of influence on them.

Short version: If we all just acted more decently towards each other, maybe our world wouldn't be as violent. But then, this is 2018, and having morals and possibly Christian values, is frowned upon by the perceived majority of people.

**longcall911** · May 26th, 2018, 04:11 PM

As with any complex problem, it is not a single factor but a combination of multiple factors that lead to these shootings. It is not just about the shooter, but his parents, his upbringing, his social skills, his friends, his teachers, the community, law enforcement, and more.

For those of us who do a good amount of troubleshooting and repair work in general, we find that the most difficult problems to figure out are those that are in fact multiple problems rolled into what appears to be one. You start working on it, find a problem fix it, and the symptoms may change but the problem is not gone. Keep at it and you find another, then another and maybe another. Finally, once all are cleared, the problem is gone.

A few of us are working on a master plan (PCTESS.com). I may be back seeking info, especially from people like unclejumbo who have direct experience.

**Metz** · May 26th, 2018, 10:14 PM

Originally Posted by Tacgunner

I can't place all my bets on the "broken windows" answer to this. In those cases that don't end in a suicidal outcome, okay, I'll concede. But it seems the lean more toward anguish, existential despair and existential nihilism for at least half of these shootings. Yeah, I know it sounds "deep think" stuff. Look up the signs...

What signs? Misanthropy is a trend for "cool people" in fairly wide circles, mainly progressive. Welcome to the 21st century

**Tacgunner** · May 26th, 2018, 11:33 PM

Originally Posted by Metz

What signs? Misanthropy is a trend for "cool people" in fairly wide circles, mainly progressive. Welcome to the 21st century

Point taken. I was unaware that dehumanization and emotional shunting was trendy. To average folks, such behavior seems...well...crazy.

Quick solution: open new asylums and round up the clearly messed-up dangerous nutcases. The moderately nuts will get the message to tone it down or get locked up. Who pays for it? Those who get locked up have their assets sold to pay for their care. Pandora's box? Yup, but it's a quick and dirty solution. Not the best, but an option. Wouldn't have the Federal gov run it, leave it to the states. States that won't (or can't) do it will become the new mecca for crazies.

Define "crazy"? That's a whole other topic for another place....

**markshere2** · May 26th, 2018, 11:46 PM

Rep button broke, agree.

**Ecclectic Collector** · May 27th, 2018, 07:13 AM

I can't begin to answer the "why". I work in a setting to see school life first hand and the amount of socially disfunctional kids hasn't changed much over the years. What is different is social media and how schools have turned into virtual prisons with an emphasis on safety and control of the kids. It is oppressive and as kids mature it becomes more and more obvious. Many a teacher I know has commented that one of the safety valves in the sheer number of kids who "self medicate" themselves day in and out.

The gun grabbers all think all they need to do is eliminate the "bad" guns. Stupid, there are no bad guns only guns and in the USA we long ago passed the point where any kind limits on access will work. My rights should not be bargained up on the alter of a cure that won't work.

So what is the solution? I don't know. Its above my pay grade to know how to fix this. Every time I see another report of a shooting, then the media frenzy that follows I cringe waiting for the next incident. Each incident sets the stage for another as socially maladjusted or mental cases gets their inspiration to commit their own act of retribution.

**Gun** · May 27th, 2018, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by Ecclectic Collector

I can't begin to answer the "why".

It's what people really don't want to talk about, because banning assault weapons is easier to stomach.

What has always been known, there are outliers, always going to be outliers, with biological problems, that include and influence mental health.

The bell curve is not just for evaluating grades.

Never before has it been so timely and important to improve health care for people with mental and substance use disorders in the US. The urgency of enhancing mental health care has been underscored by glaring social maladies, including homelessness, suicide among military personnel and veterans, incarceration, opiate addiction, and mass violence, which have galvanized public attention to mental illness. Political challenges notwithstanding, this article highlights the significant common ground that supports an agenda for transformative improvement of mental health care in the US.

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/cult...hensive-reform