Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    If I wanted to shorten the barrel on a .22/.410 over/under long gun, how would the result be classified? How would potentially shortening the stock as well figure into the final designation?

    Also, it's my understanding that if I "discovered" such an item with barrel and stock already shortened by a previous owner, but without paperwork, that the item is contraband, and there is no way to redeem it. Is that correct?
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  2. #2
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    If you want to cut a combo gun's barrels to between 12" and 17.9", it is an AOW. It doesn't matter what you do with the stock.

    https://www.atf.gov/firearms/firearm...arms-section-9

    $200 to make yourself on a Form 1, or find an SOT 2 to register and cut it down for you and transfer it on the fancy $5 red stamp.

    Seems handy for a casual backpacker gun.
    I am not a lawyer.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    The above info is correct.

    If you want to shorten the combination barrels below 12" - there isn't a firm determination as to what it should be. Some folks say it should still be a AOW, some say a dual stamp SBS+SBR.

    If it was never tax stamped PRIOR to manufacture(if made after 1968) - it is contraband forever.

    If it was made prior to 1932 and never tax stamped up until the end of 1968(there was a grace period of sorts until 1968 to get it stamped) - it is contraband thereafter.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J., PennsyPlinker, Statkowski, Deanimator, roland, aubie515

    Don't end up in my signature!

  4. #4
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Quote Originally Posted by knight0334 View Post
    The above info is correct.

    If you want to shorten the combination barrels below 12" - there isn't a firm determination as to what it should be. Some folks say it should still be a AOW, some say a dual stamp SBS+SBR.

    If it was never tax stamped PRIOR to manufacture(if made after 1968) - it is contraband forever.

    If it was made prior to 1932 and never tax stamped up until the end of 1968(there was a grace period of sorts until 1968 to get it stamped) - it is contraband thereafter.
    I believe you, but could you point me to the relevant citation? I told the person who made the inquiry to me that I would provide an actual legal clarification of the answer, even though my gut was as already stated.
    Get your "Guns Save Lives" stickers today! PM for more info.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Greg,
    The gun is defined in 26 USC 5845 (e) and here is where it would explain all: https://www.atf.gov/file/58141/download It is also spelled out in the definitions on the BATFE Form 1, (1. Definitions, c. Firearms)

    This is what 26 USC 5845 (e) says: (I bolded the area about a rifle/shotgun combo)
    (e) Any other weapon. The term 'any other weapon' means any weapon or device capable of being
    concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive, a
    pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun
    shell, weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in
    length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading
    ,
    and shall include any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire. Such term shall not include a
    pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be
    fired from the shoulder and not capable of firing fixed ammunition.

    You can build one, it is a AOW (Any Other Weapon), not a SBR or SBS and does cost $200 to build it. However, once built, it can be sold and transferred on a BATFE Form 4 for $5 as an AOW.

    Now, that said, if the said weapon has already been made into a short barrel AOW, and was never registered and the tax stamp never issued, it is contraband and needs to be disposed of to the ATF (this is where you get a lawyer involved to turn it in because of lawyer-client privilege).
    Ron USAF Ret E-8 FFL01/SOT3 NRA Benefactor Member

  6. #6
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Can I cut the barrels down to 12" and cut the stock off (pistol grip) on a sxs shotgun
    without a stamp, or is it a AOW? Just bought a beater (new) russian lawman 2 for 225.00
    and want to use it in one of my vehicles.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Not being a smart-ass, but my question would be *which* stamp I needed, not "if" I did. What would make you even consider the possibility that your intended piece would NOT be an NFA item?
    Get your "Guns Save Lives" stickers today! PM for more info.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Quote Originally Posted by gnbrotz View Post
    Not being a smart-ass, but my question would be *which* stamp I needed, not "if" I did. What would make you even consider the possibility that your intended piece would NOT be an NFA item?
    Its been a while for me with the shotgun stuff, and the shockwave came to mind (no stamp).
    I'm thinking it would be a AOW because the stock would be cut off, only the pistol grip or whatever
    that part is called will be left.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Quote Originally Posted by bogey1 View Post
    Its been a while for me with the shotgun stuff, and the shockwave came to mind (no stamp).
    I'm thinking it would be a AOW because the stock would be cut off, only the pistol grip or whatever
    that part is called will be left.
    The shockwave skirts the stamp requirement because it was made as it is, never "transformed". What you're doing is different in the eyes of the law - as ridiculous as that seems.

    My understanding is also that it would be an AOW, as an SBS would be made to be "fired from the shoulder".
    Get your "Guns Save Lives" stickers today! PM for more info.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: shortening barrel .22/.410 over/under?

    Quote Originally Posted by gnbrotz View Post
    The shockwave skirts the stamp requirement because it was made as it is, never "transformed". What you're doing is different in the eyes of the law - as ridiculous as that seems.

    My understanding is also that it would be an AOW, as an SBS would be made to be "fired from the shoulder".
    Thanks... One more question, do I need a picture of myself when filling out the form1? I used to use
    my business, so I never needed a picture before the law changed..

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