Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #31
    Join Date
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    Oh so close to the Delaware River!, New Jersey
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    Default Re: Machine gun question. M16 related.

    Quote Originally Posted by JustinHEMI View Post
    I just want to make sure that I understand something regarding M16s.


    1) The lower is the registered "machine gun", in most cases, correct?
    2) I know that there are DIAS for converting AR15s to M16s.

    I don't need 1 AND 2 to make an M16, correct?

    Here's what I mean;

    This registered lower is available;

    https://dealernfa.com/shop/brand-new...erfect-p0242a/


    I can buy that following all applicable NFA laws, and then install this, for example;

    https://www.dsarms.com/p-15152-dsa-m...les-apply.aspx


    And have a fully functioning machine gun, correct? The sear is not nor does it need to be registered, from my understanding.


    Thanks for your help.

    Justin

    PS With my recent Sig MCX "Hybrid pistol" purchase, I believe I have everything I need to make an automatic MCX on the above linked lower, hence my questions to make sure I don't run afoul of the Crown.
    I don't know much about the m-16 issue, but I.do enjoy your ever-changing TNG profile pics!

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
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    West Alexander, Pennsylvania
    (Washington County)
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    Default Re: Machine gun question. M16 related.

    Quote Originally Posted by JustinHEMI View Post
    My guy is concerned with a correction request too, since we're transferring only an M16 receiver, didn't put anything in for barrel length and overall.
    That's because there isn't such a thing as an "M16 Receiver", it's either an MG or a receiver, but not both. Since it's an MG, you need a barrel length plus overall length. Doesn't make sense, but that's what they expect.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    Chippewa, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: Machine gun question. M16 related.

    Quote Originally Posted by WCMG View Post
    That's because there isn't such a thing as an "M16 Receiver", it's either an MG or a receiver, but not both. Since it's an MG, you need a barrel length plus overall length. Doesn't make sense, but that's what they expect.
    Gotcha, so we can expect a kick back.
    Life has a melody.

  4. #34
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    Dec 2006
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    Bucks, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: Machine gun question. M16 related.

    Quote Originally Posted by WCMG View Post
    That's because there isn't such a thing as an "M16 Receiver", it's either an MG or a receiver, but not both. Since it's an MG, you need a barrel length plus overall length. Doesn't make sense, but that's what they expect.
    You may be thinking about SBR's, which have to be assembled as SBR's and have barrels in order to exist as NFA firearms.

    MG receivers are specifically included in the definition of what a "machinegun" is, along with conversion kits and complete guns. So an MG can exist as an NFA firearm while it's a receiver. (If you doubt that, tell ATF that you have recently made yourself an M16 receiver but they needn't worry because you didn't attach a barrel. Put your dogs in a kennel before trying this trick.)

    The problem is that ATF is a little paranoid now about the trick of incrementally turning a cheap registered MG into a more expensive registered MG, like taking a MAC and changing the barrel length during one transfer and then changing the caliber in another and ending up with a "registered" M-249 belt fed. So they want the current transfer paperwork to match the previous transfer paperwork on all details of the firearm.
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ungawa's M16A1 is for sale, see the NFA ads! http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.ph...06#post3835606

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
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    West Alexander, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: Machine gun question. M16 related.

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    You may be thinking about SBR's, which have to be assembled as SBR's and have barrels in order to exist as NFA firearms.

    MG receivers are specifically included in the definition of what a "machinegun" is, along with conversion kits and complete guns. So an MG can exist as an NFA firearm while it's a receiver. (If you doubt that, tell ATF that you have recently made yourself an M16 receiver but they needn't worry because you didn't attach a barrel. Put your dogs in a kennel before trying this trick.)

    The problem is that ATF is a little paranoid now about the trick of incrementally turning a cheap registered MG into a more expensive registered MG, like taking a MAC and changing the barrel length during one transfer and then changing the caliber in another and ending up with a "registered" M-249 belt fed. So they want the current transfer paperwork to match the previous transfer paperwork on all details of the firearm.
    I worded that poorly and we are saying the same thing. I have registered many lower receivers as MG's, but I had to include barrel length and overall length every time, for the exact reason you stated. My point was, the ATF will reject a Form 2 to create a machine gun if you put "MG Receiver" as the type, it's either a MG or a non-MG receiver, can't be both. It can be a MG Sear, MG Trigger Pack, etc..

  6. #36
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    Default Re: Machine gun question. M16 related.

    The form 3 between my dealers, which I have a copy of, doesn't have barrel length and overall on it, which is why he sent the form 4 to match it.
    Life has a melody.

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