Middletown Twp. board meeting-gun control laws

**steelerfan** · February 27th, 2018, 09:51 AM

Tonight it's the Neshaminy School Board's turn. Meeting tonight at 7 at Maple Point school

**Dlish** · February 27th, 2018, 11:19 AM

I emailed this to the Supervisors this morning.

As always, I appreciate the opportunity to join you at meetings and believe the ability to interact is vital to our community. I did want to follow up regarding the conversation yesterday evening concerning the Township potentially sending a memo of support for additional firearm laws that quite possibly could put further hardships upon law abiding citizens.

Unfortunately, as with many hot button issues today, the firearm debate has taken a distinctly partisan turn, with parties lined up against each other and battle lines drawn. But, I would like to ask of you to look past personal feelings regarding firearms AND party politics. With all due respect, Pennsylvania law (preemption) makes it abundantly clear that as Township Supervisors your responsibilities and jobs concerning regulating firearms is basically nil. Using the Township's voice to take a stand on an issue that very clearly falls out of your jurisdiction (and job) sets a terrible precedent. While it is your job to reflect the needs and wants of your constituents, I would encourage you to wield the Township's authority and voice with respect to items that you have direct control over: As Supervisors, your financial support and ongoing public support of the Willistown Police is a very loud voice of your concern for resident safety.

Further, as you all have taken the oath of office, I want to share a brief section of that oath to refresh your memories..."do solemnly swear or affirm that I will support, obey and defend the constitution of the United States of America and the Constitution of this Commonwealth...". It is that second part that I want to draw attention to; the PA State Constitution is even less vague in the language used regarding firearms than the US Constitution. It states "The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned." While I have not seen the memo language in question, I would urge caution on your behalf to use the Township's voice that could be in any way be construed to limit my right of defending myself. That would include any provisions on additional hurdles to attaining firearms, any language that may require storage requirements that would limit my ability to defend myself, or any other language that may infringe on my rights as granted by state and federal law.

As private citizens, we are all provided means to contact area legislators on the state and federal level, hopefully you will use your private voice to share concerns regarding laws and issues that confront us. However I do humbly request that you refrain from supporting a proposed memo that does not fall within the scope of your job. The recent events in Florida are tragic, and as a parent I cannot fathom the pain of those impacted. However, I cannot allow this, or any other tragedy to become the means of removing or limiting the freedoms that make our Township, State, and Country the most amazing place on earth. I am glad so many people came to the meeting to be heard, but I also hope that you will recognize the limits of your job responsibilities as Township Supervisors and decline taking action on this item as it is not Willistown Township's duty to speak on this issue.

Thank you for your time and attention to this matter. Should you have any questions or wish to discuss further, please don't hesitate to contact me.

**alpacaheat** · February 27th, 2018, 12:45 PM

Good letter, would have mentioned preemption too.

18 PA.C.S. § 6120 states, “No county, municipality or township may in any manner regulate the lawful ownership, possession, transfer or transportation of firearms, ammunition or ammunition components when carried or transported for purposes not prohibited by the laws of this Commonwealth.”

**Knightshift** · February 27th, 2018, 12:59 PM

Hope your e-mail actually gets read by them. Unfortunately, the bandwagon they are jumping on will be getting very crowded indeed.

**jgl** · February 27th, 2018, 11:27 PM

After careful consideration of the "facts and fantasies" being presented recently in the media concerning gun rights, I would agree perhaps it is truly time for change.
The overwhelming majority of gun owners are law abiding citizens that go about their everyday business without the general public even knowing they are gun owners or supporters of the Second Amendment. To a large extent, this has been our goal, "no one needs to know".

Here is the rub.... to the media, politicians (local, state, and federal) and the general public we are a nameless, faceless group. As a group we don't stage sit-ins, we don't plan million person marches, we don't burn flags or pull down monuments. We exist under the radar. We do an excellent job not letting the media, politicians and general public confront the fact we are parents, grandparents, teachers, doctors, construction workers, school bus drivers, you know...average hard working citizens choosing to exercise a Constitutional right.

Maybe we need a change, become more visible, become more vocal. Instead of being on the defensive to protect gun rights move to the offensive and profess gun rights.

**Statkowski** · February 27th, 2018, 11:59 PM

Using the five-year stats available elsewhere on this site, remind them exactly what percentage of the adult population for their county is licensed to carry by the Commonwealth.

**steelerfan** · February 28th, 2018, 11:35 AM

Originally Posted by jgl

After careful consideration of the "facts and fantasies" being presented recently in the media concerning gun rights, I would agree perhaps it is truly time for change.
The overwhelming majority of gun owners are law abiding citizens that go about their everyday business without the general public even knowing they are gun owners or supporters of the Second Amendment. To a large extent, this has been our goal, "no one needs to know".

Here is the rub.... to the media, politicians (local, state, and federal) and the general public we are a nameless, faceless group. As a group we don't stage sit-ins, we don't plan million person marches, we don't burn flags or pull down monuments. We exist under the radar. We do an excellent job not letting the media, politicians and general public confront the fact we are parents, grandparents, teachers, doctors, construction workers, school bus drivers, you know...average hard working citizens choosing to exercise a Constitutional right.

Maybe we need a change, become more visible, become more vocal. Instead of being on the defensive to protect gun rights move to the offensive and profess gun rights.

A good point here. It seems we always have to be on the defensive

**abner13** · February 28th, 2018, 11:37 AM

If states don't have to obey federal laws , why should towns/townships obey state laws?

**Statkowski** · February 28th, 2018, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by Statkowski

Using the five-year stats available elsewhere on this site, remind them exactly what percentage of the adult population for their county is licensed to carry by the Commonwealth.

Found them. Delaware County's 2016 adult population (age 21 or over) was 412,773. Out of that, some 33,725 residents possess an LTCF. That's 8.2% of the county's adult population. In other words, 1 out of every 12 adults.

**dd45acp** · May 21st, 2019, 06:05 PM

I believe the Chief of Police of Middletown Township is highly Anti 2nd amendment. In 2014 While unloading my HK .45 USP I accidentally discharged the weapon and shot myself in the leg. YES I KNOW STUPID! No excuse except I was rushing to leave for work. I paid my stupid tax.

Well the Detective that responded to the hospital took my HK, and said after the investigation I would get it back. Trying to be a law abiding citizen and having nothing to hide I agreed. After the investigation confirmed there was no crime and was accidental, I was contacted by the Detective and told that in order to get my firearm back I would have to Sue the Township in PA Superior Court. I would have to pay all court costs and after speaking with two attorneys was told I would likely never see the firearm again. I could fight in court but it would have cost me more then the gun was worth.

Tell me how in the US the Government can seize your property and keep it without charging you with a crime. I may not be a lawyer but it seems to me that this practice is a clear violation of both the 4th and 2nd amendments. but seems to be standard practice in Middletown Township.

I know it is common practice because about a year later my neighbor committed suicide by firearm. The Middletown Township police seized ALL firearms in the residence, and refused to give them back to the widow. Even though he locked himself in a bedroom, took a bottle of Xanax and shot himself. She had nothing at all to do with it. I can only imagine how many more Guns this Police Chief has stolen from Law Abiding Citizens.