Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #381
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    Quote Originally Posted by KJP442 View Post
    Does anyone have a list of talking points/sources/stats to bring up when meeting with our reps/senators? I'd like to not sound like an idiot if I actually get face time with one of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Berncly View Post
    I will try to post some talking points this weekend.
    I hope others will do the same.

    The FOAC should have talking points available, you can email them if you can't locate the talking points on their website.

    It's good to have a paragraph or two typed out in a letter to hand the receptionist when your rep is "out to lunch".
    If you are able to talk to your rep face to face, you can just relay what is in your letter and then give it to them when you're finished talking.

    Irrespective of your verbiage, the important thing to relay is that you are a registered voter, that you vote in every election, and that you and your family only vote for candidates that support and defend your national and state Constitutional right to keep and bear arms.
    http://www.2arally.com/pennsylvania-...endment-issues

    FOAC talking points for PA 2A Rally April 30 2018

    Pennsylvania Second Amendment Issues Last Updated: 03/21/2018

    Declared Emergency Gun Ban Fix – HB2021

    HB2021 (Rep. Dowling) this legislation ‘eliminates’ the unconstitutional gun ban in Title 18 §6107. Current law gives State ‘and’ Local executives the power to ban firearms, except for citizens with Licenses to Carry Firearms, on all ‘public property’ just by declaring an Emergency. Circumventing the Constitution, especially during Emergencies, is not only ‘unconstitutional’ but just wrongheaded.

    This legislation completely removes this authority to strip citizens of their rights in these dire circumstances!

    Pennsylvania Instant Check System Reform - HB 763 and SB224

    For years Pennsylvania has been wasting millions of dollars supporting a state-specific background check system that can be replaced with sole use of the federal National Instant Check System. In addition to the wasted taxpayer money, the PICS system has for years been used and abused by politicians and bureaucrats to skirt Pennsylvania law against keeping a gun owner registry. It is our goal to evaluate PICS and determine whether it can justify it's continued cost.

    Constitutional Carry (Two-Tiered) - HB170

    Constitutional Carry creates a presumption that if you can legally possess a firearm then a 'license' is not required within the state, concealed or not, for law abiding citizens. When a state or other jurisdiction has adopted Constitutional Carry, it is legal for law-abiding citizens to carry a handgun, firearm, or other weapon concealed with or without an applicable permit or license.

    Further, this law decriminalizes the carry of handguns for self-defense purposes without a license, and puts the burden upon a prosecutor to prove criminal intent of a person carrying a handgun. Also, there are no defined statutory limits as to ‘how’ a legally carried handgun should be carried openly or concealed; thus it is considered Constitutional Carry.

    This legislation creates a two-tiered system with the carrying of firearms for lawful purposes:

    Option 1 gives citizens the ability to obtain a (LTCF) License To Carry Firearm permit that is valid throughout Pennsylvania and would provide for carrying firearms in other states.

    Option 2 recognizes that Commonwealth citizens have a fundamental constitutional right to keep and bear arms (Article 1, Section 21) and that ‘no LTCF' is required for law abiding citizens to carry a firearm throughout Pennsylvania.

    Strengthening Castle Doctrine / Disparity of Force in self-defense protection - HB167

    While Pennsylvania generally has very reasonable laws relating to the Use of Force and lawful self-defense, a current quirk in the wording of the law creates ambiguity with regards to self-defense where force disparity is not as clear as an attacker with a weapon capable of inflicting serious bodily harm. This proposal would make it clear under Pennsylvania law that a disparity in strength, size, and number of attackers can constitute a threat of serious bodily harm or death.

    Strengthening of PA Firearms Preemption Laws - HB671 - SB5

    Local communities have been enacting, or maintaining, gun laws that violate PA Law prohibiting these laws. This is in violation of Title 18, Section 6120 which is clear and unequivocating in this prohibition with the penalty being found in Title 18, section 6119. Current Pennsylvania law was initially enacted in 1974 and since this law is in the PA Crimes Codes the enforcement of this prohibition falls to County District Attorneys who have failed miserably in holding these communities accountable for violating PA Law.

    What these bills would do, respectively, is amend either Title 18, Section 6120 (HB 671) or Title 53 (SB 5) with clear language to add standing for individuals and organizations to sue communities which are in violation of the law preemptively and prior to actually being prosecuted. Should an organization or individual win a legal action against a community acting in a criminal fashion this legislation would then provide for legal costs reimbursement.

    Stop the Pennsylvania State Police Gun Registry - HB156

    Under Pennsylvania law it is illegal for any government entity to maintain a registry of Pennsylvanian's guns. However, since 1931 the Pennsylvania State Police have maintained a registry of 'all' handgun purchasers in Pennsylvania. Since 1998 the PICS (Pennsylvania Instant Check System) has expanded the compilation of this "Record Of Sales (ROS) database". The PA Supreme Court, in 2004, made a politically correct decision that the Record Of Sales database was incomplete and let the PSP continue to accrue private gun owner information. Numerous anti-gun politicians have seen the weak foundation of the PA Supreme Court decision and have introduced numerous bills to 'legalize' the ROS collection of gun owner info. This bill will put a stop to such nonsense by clearly stating that such a database is a registry as prohibited by Pennsylvania law.

    Concealed Carry Reciprocity Simplification - HB155

    Currently, Pennsylvania's system for concealed carry permit reciprocity with other states is an overly complicated process that allows for potential abuse by politically motivated Attorneys General. This bill would streamline Pennsylvania's reciprocity system by simplifying how comparable laws from other states are reviewed and used to evaluate licensing requirements.

    Correcting Firearm Transportation Laws (under development)

    Due to poorly worded statutory language and definitions, there is common confusion about transporting firearms in Pennsylvania. We hope to clarify the wording and intent of the Uniform Firearms Act in order to provide gun owners with a clear understanding of how to legally transport firearms throughout the Commonwealth.
    Targeting Violent Criminals Using Firearms in Crime - Offense Sentences - HB166

    This proposal would ensure that criminals that commit violence with firearms serve their sentences consecutively, preventing abuse of the plea bargaining system that allows violent criminals to get out of jail sooner than they should.

    --

    How to: Traveling with your lawfully carried firearm to the Capitol and for the Rally is legal and lawful! The law requires government to provide lockers to secure firearms and you will need to Print out and fill in this form at the link - link to file - and arrive by at least 9 am (the day of the Rally) to check your firearm. Follow the signs and please understand that 'no long guns' can be secured in the lockers.
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  2. #382
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    .
    More PA gun rights talking points from the GOA.


    https://cqrcengage.com/gunowners/app...ementId=466034

    Contact your state legislators in opposition to SB 1141 and HB 2227.

    Gun Confiscation Orders, “red flag laws” or “extreme risk protection orders” would authorize the police or an angry “ex” to convene a secret star-chamber “ex parte” hearing on whether to suspend your Second, Fourth, and Fourteenth Amendment rights
    .

    Gun Confiscation Coming to Pennsylvania?

    In a dramatic attack on the Second Amendment, the Pennsylvania legislature is moving to authorize Gun Confiscation Orders in the Keystone State.

    The bill numbers are Senate Bill 1141 in the Senate and House Bill 2227 in the House.

    At their core, Gun Confiscation Orders — cynically disguised as “red flag laws” or “extreme risk protection orders” -- would authorize the police or an angry “ex” to convene a secret star-chamber “ex parte” hearing on whether to suspend your Second, Fourth, and Fourteenth Amendment rights.

    The first thing gun owners learn is when police knock on the door -- ready to ransack their house and, if you resist, to arrest or even shoot you and your family.

    The standard is not whether there is probable cause to believe that the gun owner has committed a crime, as the Constitution would seem to require. Rather, the standard is some subjective determination about whether the gun owner represents some “danger.”

    As in the film Minority Report, Americans are stripped of their fundamental constitutional rights based on the subjective possibility of a “future crime.”

    And we know from our limited experience that many accusers lie or make mistakes -- even more reach delusional conclusions -- and the target is frequently an abused victim who is most in need of the wherewithal to protect against an abuser.

    When the accuser is the only one in court, the judge will normally sign the order. Thus, in Seattle, 28 of 29 Gun Confiscation Order applications were approved.

    In Massachusetts, in connection with analogous but less far-reaching “restraining orders,” one of sponsors admitted that “judges don't ask very many questions” before rubber stamping ex parte orders.

    After a fixed period of time, the gun owner can ask for a court hearing to restore his or her constitutional rights.

    But guess what? Few gun owners have the sophistication or the thousands of dollars it would take to hire a lawyer and expert witnesses.

    And few courts are willing to second-guess themselves and reverse the Gun Confiscation Order which has been issued.

    In fact, hundreds of thousands of veterans have lost their gun rights without due process pursuant to a comparable procedure.

    And recent revelations from the VA suggest that fewer than 50 have successfully invoked this “process” to get their rights back.

    Although they preexisted in a couple of states, Gun Confiscation Orders really picked up steam when the Bloomberg/Giffords gun control organizations decided to push them as the most extreme aspect of California's anti-gun laws.

    Since then, the bills have been mass-produced based on a template in the backroom of Bloomberg's New York offices and exported for quickie adoption in states like Pennsylvania, with only minor tweaks.

    Amazingly, the tweaks made by Bloomberg's Pennsylvania agents make this state's gun confiscation bills much more insidious than most other states:

    • There is absolute civil and criminal immunity, which means that an angry “ex” can bring a vengeful, bad faith ex parte petition without consequences, so long as the person couches their lies in subjective accusations. It also means that police can break down your door and shoot you and your family without consequences.

    • The definitions are poorly crafted and could expand the universe of complainants to distant relatives and high school sweethearts.

    • Even if a gun owner is absent or unrepresented, the burden of proof is a scintilla of evidence past 50% in order to strip a person of his constitutional rights.

    But there's a larger issue: If the Constitution can be suspended in a secret hearing, where does this lead?

    What if this newspaper could be shut down for 21 days without due process -- based on a secret complaint? Or an individual could be arrested or imprisoned for 21 days? Or tortured?

    Far from being a “consensus proposal,” the suspension of the Constitution in a secret hearing is a constitutional Rubicon from which there is no return.

    So please contact your state legislators today in opposition to SB 1141 and HB 2227.
    Last edited by Berncly; April 29th, 2018 at 12:27 AM. Reason: typo
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  3. #383
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    I am never ceased to be amazed by some of my brothers in arms. So much talk of carrying outside when in actuality the rally is inside in the Rotunda. Yes, you have the right to muddle about outside. Yes, you have a right to carry openly. But why? You catch more flies with honey than vinegar. Check your carry gun, leave your long gun at home, and dress for success. Your right to parade around with a slung AR does not trump my right to peacefully assemble and seek redress of grievances from the Government. In light of the recent House "hearings" on gun safety, the deck is stacked against us. Please don't give the anti gun faction another front page photo that will be sensationalized to scare the shit out of the ill informed. You are falling right into the hands of CeaseFirePA, Moms Demand Action, Bloomberg and Soros. I'm done preaching. I cannot attend this year, as I'm still in physical therapy for a back issue. Raise your voice at your legislators office.
    WOP 2-The Original Spaghetti Western

  4. #384
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    https://gunowners.org/statealert42018.htm

    Rally for the 2A with Larry Pratt!

    Published: 20 April 2018

    Support the 2A at the State Capitol Rotunda April 30

    Turnout to support the Second Amendment and meet GOA’s Larry Pratt!

    Dear friend:

    I have an exciting opportunity to share with you.

    GOA’s executive director emeritus, Larry Pratt, will be speaking at a gun rights rally at the State Capitol Rotunda in Harrisburg on April 30.

    He will be joined by pro-gun lawmakers and other Second Amendment activists.

    As you know, anti-gunners have turned out in full force at marches, exploiting tragedies to take your gun rights away.

    As gun owners, we can’t be silent. That’s why it’s important you attend this rally in Harrisburg.

    So please make plans to attend this rally at the Capitol Rotunda in Harrisburg on April 30 beginning at 10 a.m.

    I know Larry is looking forward to seeing you there!

    In liberty,

    Jordan Stein
    Director of Communcaitons
    Gun Owners of America
    Follow me on Twitter: @jordankstein

    PS: From gun confiscation orders to bump stock bans, GOA is working around the clock to stop gun control. Please consider joining so we have as many people as possible united in our cause. https://gunowners.org/
    Last edited by Berncly; April 29th, 2018 at 12:29 AM. Reason: typo
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  5. #385
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    Just refreshing everybody's memory I WILL BE OUTSIDE WITH MY BIG, BLACK, HORRIFYING, TRIGGERING, NIGHTMARE MAKING, DAVID HOGG HATEING AR-"no child is safe around it"-15. That is all, i will see you there.

  6. #386
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    Quote Originally Posted by WOP2 View Post
    I am never ceased to be amazed by some of my brothers in arms. So much talk of carrying outside when in actuality the rally is inside in the Rotunda. Yes, you have the right to muddle about outside. Yes, you have a right to carry openly. But why? You catch more flies with honey than vinegar. Check your carry gun, leave your long gun at home, and dress for success. Your right to parade around with a slung AR does not trump my right to peacefully assemble and seek redress of grievances from the Government. In light of the recent House "hearings" on gun safety, the deck is stacked against us. Please don't give the anti gun faction another front page photo that will be sensationalized to scare the shit out of the ill informed. You are falling right into the hands of CeaseFirePA, Moms Demand Action, Bloomberg and Soros. I'm done preaching. I cannot attend this year, as I'm still in physical therapy for a back issue. Raise your voice at your legislators office.
    if they gave two shits they'd have listened to our complaining for the last two years, no?
    you have a point but i don't think you're swaying our reps out of the standstill without a suitcase of money.

    there have been two outdoor rallies this month at the capitol, no? all have gone off without so much as a whisper. they'll do their damnedest to pretend we don't exist so long as no one is arrested.
    after all, you can't have people seeing a group of EBR's without a massacre. they might begin to think guns are inanimate objects.

    but on the topic, how many people are planning on being outside? 3 plus me?
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

  7. #387
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    I don't care what people do, or how they do it.
    The important thing is to be there to show that people are standing up to defend the 2A.
    Larry Pratt from the GOA will say a few words at the podium which should be good.
    How can you have any cookies if you don't drink your milk?

  8. #388
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    Anybody bringing signs to be held in the rotunda? (similar to Drop-leg Jeff last year...)
    - bamboomaster

  9. #389
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    Quote Originally Posted by fallenleader View Post
    if they gave two shits they'd have listened to our complaining for the last two years, no?
    . . .
    Oh, who says they haven't listened? What new gun controls have passed in the last, let's say 7 years? To my recollection none. There have been 2 major pro-gun acts though; Castle Doctrine, and Act 192 preemption which was later found unconstitutional based on the process it went through (single topic rule).

    Those who hang outside contribute nothing and in fact, invite the press to photograph them and imply that "a dozen people showed up from across the entire state". But no, I'll do it my way because I know better than the people who have organized the rally, (Daryl Metcalfe, Kim Stolfer and others who have fought for 2A in PA for decades).

  10. #390
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    Default Re: ***2018 Second Amendment Harrisburg Rally*** 4/30/18

    You open carry assholes are going to ruin it for everyone! Why can't you just cover up?


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