Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Unhappy Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    I'm an Army veteran and gun owner. The 'good guy with a gun' theory is a myth.


    nbcnews.com/think/opinion/i-m-army-veteran-gun-owner-good-guy-gun-theory-ncna821976

    Last week, another man with another high-powered rifle opened fire on Americans with the intent to kill as many people as possible. Before being shot and killed by police, Kevin Janson Neal murdered his wife and riddled a grade school in rural Rancho Tehama Reserve with bullets, ultimately killing five people. In a busy news cycle, the shooting barely registered at the national level. This is our new reality.

    But due in large part to the longstanding political apathy towards gun control legislation, a concerning phenomenon has emerged in the wake of the mass shooting epidemic: the myth of “the good guy with a gun.”

    Our nation’s love of firearms, combined with our history of arrogance and hyper-masculinity, has produced a culture in which millions of (particularly younger) white men now believe they could, at any time, be the only thing standing between good and evil. A quick search on YouTube will provide countless videos of these would-be superheroes strolling down city streets with powerful rifles on display, begging for law enforcement to challenge their constitutional rights.

    This is not simply an issue of Second Amendment rights, however. The world is a dangerous place, and these would-be crime stoppers claim that a good guy with a gun must be ready and willing to stop a bad guy with a gun. As evidence, they point to high-profile stories like the recent Texas shooting at First Baptist Church, in which a good Samaritan with a gun chased and ultimately wounded the shooter as he left the church. He did not prevent the massacre, but maybe he could have, if he had only gotten there earlier — at least, that’s what these people argue.

    People pray in the First Baptist Church of Sutherland Springs on November 12, 2017 where 26 people were killed in a shooting attack. Rick Wilking / Reuters
    The problem with this narrative (besides a lack of research or data suggesting more guns does indeed prevent violence broadly) is that killing another human being, even a “bad” one, is not easy. This is not “Call of Duty”: Despite the damage that modern weaponry can inflict, there is a reason that soldiers and law enforcement officers receive thousands of hours of training in firearms and tactics. This training is physical, mechanical and, most importantly, psychological, because in order to efficiently and effectively kill other human beings in high-stress situations, one must be conditioned to negotiate that stress.

    I should know, because I went through it. As an U.S. Army infantryman, I spent thousands of hours, beginning in basic training and continuing throughout my service, becoming comfortable with killing and learning how to do so in a responsible manner. The psychological strength required to act quickly and effectively in a mass shooting comes from the kind of monotonous training that over several years builds up muscle memory. It is tedious and often boring, and that’s the point: it enables soldiers to respond in stressful situations as though it’s second nature.

    The U.S. Army’s basic marksmanship training — just learning how to care for a rifle and shoot it — is three weeks long. That’s 18 full days (Sundays are usually semi-restful) spent getting comfortable with your rifle, learning how to dissemble and reassemble it, clean it, perform a functions check, correct malfunctions, load and unload it, conduct peer training with fellow privates, adjust its sights and, finally, how to actually aim and fire it.
    Gun Owners of America lifetime member! Same sex marriage is an oxymoron!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyg101 View Post
    I'm an Army veteran and gun owner. The 'good guy with a gun' theory is a myth.


    nbcnews.com/think/opinion/i-m-army-veteran-gun-owner-good-guy-gun-theory-ncna821976

    Last week, another man with another high-powered rifle opened fire on Americans with the intent to kill as many people as possible. Before being shot and killed by police, Kevin Janson Neal murdered his wife and riddled a grade school in rural Rancho Tehama Reserve with bullets, ultimately killing five people. In a busy news cycle, the shooting barely registered at the national level. This is our new reality.

    But due in large part to the longstanding political apathy towards gun control legislation, a concerning phenomenon has emerged in the wake of the mass shooting epidemic: the myth of “the good guy with a gun.”

    Our nation’s love of firearms, combined with our history of arrogance and hyper-masculinity, has produced a culture in which millions of (particularly younger) white men now believe they could, at any time, be the only thing standing between good and evil. A quick search on YouTube will provide countless videos of these would-be superheroes strolling down city streets with powerful rifles on display, begging for law enforcement to challenge their constitutional rights.

    This is not simply an issue of Second Amendment rights, however. The world is a dangerous place, and these would-be crime stoppers claim that a good guy with a gun must be ready and willing to stop a bad guy with a gun. As evidence, they point to high-profile stories like the recent Texas shooting at First Baptist Church, in which a good Samaritan with a gun chased and ultimately wounded the shooter as he left the church. He did not prevent the massacre, but maybe he could have, if he had only gotten there earlier — at least, that’s what these people argue.

    People pray in the First Baptist Church of Sutherland Springs on November 12, 2017 where 26 people were killed in a shooting attack. Rick Wilking / Reuters
    The problem with this narrative (besides a lack of research or data suggesting more guns does indeed prevent violence broadly) is that killing another human being, even a “bad” one, is not easy. This is not “Call of Duty”: Despite the damage that modern weaponry can inflict, there is a reason that soldiers and law enforcement officers receive thousands of hours of training in firearms and tactics. This training is physical, mechanical and, most importantly, psychological, because in order to efficiently and effectively kill other human beings in high-stress situations, one must be conditioned to negotiate that stress.

    I should know, because I went through it. As an U.S. Army infantryman, I spent thousands of hours, beginning in basic training and continuing throughout my service, becoming comfortable with killing and learning how to do so in a responsible manner. The psychological strength required to act quickly and effectively in a mass shooting comes from the kind of monotonous training that over several years builds up muscle memory. It is tedious and often boring, and that’s the point: it enables soldiers to respond in stressful situations as though it’s second nature.

    The U.S. Army’s basic marksmanship training — just learning how to care for a rifle and shoot it — is three weeks long. That’s 18 full days (Sundays are usually semi-restful) spent getting comfortable with your rifle, learning how to dissemble and reassemble it, clean it, perform a functions check, correct malfunctions, load and unload it, conduct peer training with fellow privates, adjust its sights and, finally, how to actually aim and fire it.
    Ah the Genderqueer moron that thinks that he knows better than anyone else, his article is so full of fail it overdosed.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    "A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself"

    "He created the game, played the game, and lost the game.... All under his own terms, by his own doing." JW34

    "Tolerance is the lube that helps slip the dildo of dysfunction into the ass of a civilized society." Plato

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    So how are the bad guys able to shoot if they have not had training?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    Quote Originally Posted by DennisH82 View Post
    Ah the Genderqueer moron that thinks that he knows better than anyone else, his article is so full of fail it overdosed.

    Based on this freak 'cis' * logic then we need not keep fire extinguishers and let is do away with CPR training (CPR is not 100% effective )












    *As in he/she and now cis.... the knew gender speak.
    Last edited by vinnyg101; November 21st, 2017 at 06:34 PM.
    Gun Owners of America lifetime member! Same sex marriage is an oxymoron!

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    Quote Originally Posted by James6406 View Post
    So how are the bad guys able to shoot if they have not had training?
    ^^^ This, right here ^^^

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    The main proof that good guys with guns are a threat to bad guys with guns, is that almost every bad guy with a gun puts great effort into not committing his crimes where good guys with guns are likely to be found.

    That, plus millions of defensive uses and displays of guns every year, saving countless lives and stopping unknowable numbers of rapes.

    It's not a silver bullet; a good guy with a gun can certainly screw up, and get shot by police. But he can also interrupt the horrific plans of bad guys, who very often continue killing until opposed by anyone with a gun.

    Exclude all of the spree shootings in "gun free zones" and we turn out not to have much of a spree-shooting problem here in America. What's the murder rate at gun shows?
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ce sac n'est pas un jouet.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyg101 View Post
    [B]

    I should know, because I went through it. As an U.S. Army infantryman, I spent thousands of hours, beginning in basic training and continuing throughout my service, becoming comfortable with killing and learning how to do so in a responsible manner.

    The U.S. Army’s basic marksmanship training — just learning how to care for a rifle and shoot it — is three weeks long. That’s 18 full days (Sundays are usually semi-restful) spent getting comfortable with your rifle, learning how to dissemble and reassemble it, clean it, perform a functions check, correct malfunctions, load and unload it, conduct peer training with fellow privates, adjust its sights and, finally, how to actually aim and fire it.
    I must have been in the wrong infantry school when I enlisted. My BRM was a week long and we weren't allowed to touch our firearms until they were checked out to us on the day/s we were to use them. Never while I was in basic were we allowed to take our rifles into the barracks. Sunday's were meant only for worship or cleaning the barracks. Where did this person go to infantry school, Fort Leonard Wood? (yes I know the only infantry school is Benning)

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    there is a reason that soldiers and law enforcement officers receive thousands of hours of training in firearms and tactics.
    Thousands?? A couple of hundred maybe. One thousand hours is 125 training days of 8 hours or 25 weeks at five days a week.

    Maybe some of you law enforcement folks can help out here. Act 120 training is around 800 hours, but how much is firearms related training and what portion of that is actual firing time on the range? I guess if you count training in total you could rack up a couple (two) thousand hours in a career with updates, refreshers, re-qualification, and the like. (I know it seems like years when you are taking it)

    In my active competitive shooting years I did like 150-200 hours in practice and matches annually, and I was not as gung ho as a lot of the gang I shot with. How many police or military (not deployed) do that much?
    Last edited by gghbi; November 22nd, 2017 at 10:30 PM.
    Illegitimus non carborundum est

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Liar, liar pants on fire! --> The 'good guy with a gun' is a myth

    I didn't need to read past "high powered rifle" in the first sentence to know he was both a POS and full of shit.

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