Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Upper Darby, Pennsylvania
    (Delaware County)
    Age
    51
    Posts
    2,781
    Rep Power
    20835252

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt.K View Post
    I would not be admitting error until someone provided a citation to said "established case law".
    Quote Originally Posted by timdennis View Post
    Yes, he(Police) can-US Supreme Court Decision.

    Pennsylvania v. Mimms, 434 U.S. 106
    I am admitting error. See, it's possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by unclejumbo View Post
    Very handy for those folks that like to roll the window down a tiny bit and hand out documents through a 1/2 inch gap.

    "Would you please roll the window down so I can hear you?"

    "No, I don't have to."

    "No, no you don't. Step out of the car so I can hear you."
    As suggested upthread, folks, the roadside is not the best place for the discussion - unless you have *ALL* of your I's crossed and your T's dotted, and even then it's not advisable.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Glen Mills, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    4,332
    Rep Power
    21474846

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by snuffy19608 View Post
    There's a video making its way around FB recently that I got into it with some other posters about. Motorist is pulled over for a taillight out. Officer comes to drivers window, asks motorist if he has any weapons. Motorist replies in the affirmative. Not sure, but I think he told the officer he had a LTCF in his state. Motorists wife is very loud, causing issues. Officer asks motorist to step out of the vehicle for his (officers) safety. Motorist refuses, citing the fact that his weapon is being carried legally plus the fact that his son is in the rear seat. Wife is NOT helping, getting loud. Long story short , motorist ends up getting forcibly removed from the vehicle.

    As can be expected, several comments were left on FB, all stating that "he should just obey". I dissented, and stated that I did not think the officer had cause to remove the motorist as he did. I was told this is "established case law", and one poster informed me he would be waiting for me to admit I was wrong. Am I?
    This is one where this PAFOA has definitely affected my thinking. Before joining this site I would have been in the "he shouldn't have to because he is doing nothing wrong camp. But having read other perspectives over the years I am in the "I'm not winning anything on the side of the road, I will deal with it afterwards camp".
    Proof Armed citizens make a difference. http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=316012

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    "The Country", Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
    Posts
    1,811
    Rep Power
    21474842

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Traffic stops are scary as hell. We've practiced them using simmunitions. It's a real eye opener when you're walking up to the driver's side window at an angle, and all you see is a firearm quickly pop out the window and shoot you in the head while you are 15 feet back. Our "role player" didn't even stick his head out the window to aim. He did a spray and pray.
    "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery." - Thomas Jefferson

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Lancaster, Pennsylvania
    (Lancaster County)
    Age
    49
    Posts
    3,910
    Rep Power
    21474850

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by philadelphia patriot View Post
    Traffic stops are scary as hell. We've practiced them using simmunitions. It's a real eye opener when you're walking up to the driver's side window at an angle, and all you see is a firearm quickly pop out the window and shoot you in the head while you are 15 feet back. Our "role player" didn't even stick his head out the window to aim. He did a spray and pray.
    But a few guys on here say that's impossible.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Mechanicsburg, Pennsylvania
    (Cumberland County)
    Posts
    566
    Rep Power
    4535178

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    you guys are getting to worked up about law. You need to deal in facts. When I was in my early 20's I was stopped in York for doing a burn out. I was told to exit the car. I know if I had not I would have been taken out. I was hand cuffed. Had I resisted I would have still been hand cuffed. My buddy was loudly protesting all this and threatened with arrest. I know he would have been arrested whether legal or not. When you are pulled over it is in your best interest to do what ever they tell you to do. Along the road the fact is, they are the law and most times in court they are still the law.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
    (Allegheny County)
    Posts
    1,971
    Rep Power
    21474841

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Walleye Hunter View Post
    [SIZE=3]Call me a pussy but I treat any and all police with respect, even if/when they are dead wrong.
    I treat them as someone who can easily kill me and get away with it. I try to behave accordingly.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Upper Darby, Pennsylvania
    (Delaware County)
    Age
    51
    Posts
    2,781
    Rep Power
    20835252

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by free View Post
    I treat them as someone who can easily kill me and get away with it. I try to behave accordingly.
    There is some level of wisdom here...

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Willow Grove, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
    Posts
    3,362
    Rep Power
    21474848

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    With loud disruptive wife in the passenger seat, I'll be the first to ask the cop, if I can get the hell out of the car and continue conbersation in relative peace and quiet
    Je suis déplorable

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Brookville, Pennsylvania
    (Jefferson County)
    Age
    45
    Posts
    18,001
    Rep Power
    21474865

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    Muzzles... ...they aren't only for dogs.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Mercer, Pennsylvania
    (Mercer County)
    Age
    37
    Posts
    37
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: Help with FB discussion

    I agree seeing the video would be helpful. But based on the description I have to agree he should have just gotten out. By refusing to get out it makes it appear that he is hiding something.
    However it seems that could have been avoided had he looked at his wife and told her to pipe down. The louder people get the more tension it creates and it sounds like the officer was just trying to separate them to ease that tension.

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