Do PA Law enforcement need to show ID if requested?

[digitalt]

Not specifically firearms related, but thought I would ask anyway.

I had a strange situation happen at a Fishing/Hunting show in Lancaster yesterday and afterthoughts hit me.

I had butterfly knives displayed for sale that are legal in PA and this person came up to me and asked if I had any "automatic knives" AKA switchblades for sale. Of course I didn't because they are illegal in PA and stated such.

My question is, I know I could ask this person if he was law enforcement. Are PA law enforcement required to present their ID if asked, "Are you law enforcement and may I see your ID?". Weird situation to say the least since this person seemed to be closely scoping everyone's displays.

Again, know this isn't specifically firearms related, but just wondered.

[philadelphia patriot]

If they identify as law enforcement, I would say yes. There is no way anyone working undercover would have to answer "yes" and show their ID if asked. If they did every convicted drug dealer would be appealing their cases if they sold to undercover cops.

[digitalt]

On the flip side to your reply, if asked and they didn't identify as law enforcement and then busted the drug dealer, it would be entrapment.

Maybe pagunlawyer can weigh in.

[allenr]

I tried to find info on the OP question. The only thing I could find was that uniformed officers had to have both a name tag and badge clearly visible. I would expect that a LEO during some sort of enforcement action would initially not be required to show more than a badge. It is reasonable to make an officer on a traffic stop actually retrieve some sort of credentials? I don't think so because that officer has to be able to protect himself, and that would be harder to do while retrieving wallet of credential holder. Admittedly, I am making an assumption.

[unclejumbo]

On the flip side to your reply, if asked and they didn't identify as law enforcement and then busted the drug dealer, it would be entrapment.

Maybe pagunlawyer can weigh in.

That's not the definition of entrapment. Entrapment is law enforcement coercing a person to commit a crime that ordinarily that person wouldn't commit. Say you have Oxy from a recent surgery. A friend of friend "needs" Oxy to help him though a severe toothache until his dentist is open on Monday. You say no, friend and toothache man show up at your house, begging and pleading for some Oxy. He'll pay you, he just needs some for the pain...begging and pleading until you do sell him a few. Then you get busted for possession with intent to distribute. And even if you asked toothache man 10 times if he was a cop, him telling you no would not be the entrapment. The entrapment would be the coercing you into something you wouldn't ordinarily do.

[internet troll]

Not specifically firearms related, but thought I would ask anyway.

I had a strange situation happen at a Fishing/Hunting show in Lancaster yesterday and afterthoughts hit me.

I had butterfly knives displayed for sale that are legal in PA and this person came up to me and asked if I had any "automatic knives" AKA switchblades for sale. Of course I didn't because they are illegal in PA and stated such.

My question is, I know I could ask this person if he was law enforcement. Are PA law enforcement required to present their ID if asked, "Are you law enforcement and may I see your ID?". Weird situation to say the least since this person seemed to be closely scoping everyone's displays.

Again, know this isn't specifically firearms related, but just wondered.

I know snopes can be suspect, but I think okay with questions like this.

http://www.snopes.com/risque/hookers/cop.asp

[GunLawyer001]

That's not the definition of entrapment. Entrapment is law enforcement coercing a person to commit a crime that ordinarily that person wouldn't commit. Say you have Oxy from a recent surgery. A friend of friend "needs" Oxy to help him though a severe toothache until his dentist is open on Monday. You say no, friend and toothache man show up at your house, begging and pleading for some Oxy. He'll pay you, he just needs some for the pain...begging and pleading until you do sell him a few. Then you get busted for possession with intent to distribute. And even if you asked toothache man 10 times if he was a cop, him telling you no would not be the entrapment. The entrapment would be the coercing you into something you wouldn't ordinarily do.

Yep, entrapment is extreme coercion, and the courts don't like to apply it; there was a case where undercover cops made threats against the suspect's family if he refused to go along with the crime, and the courts held that they were acting in the role of drug dealers, and drug dealers would have made such threats, so it was OK and not entrapment.

At the same time, John DeLorean beat the rap when DEA agents found out that his company was folding, he would be internationally embarrassed, his Irish factory employees would all lose their jobs and his company would go bankrupt unless he found a quick infusion of cash. So they posed as drug dealers who needed him to bankroll a major deal, one that would be a one-time thing that generated him enough cash to save his car company. Then they busted him when he yielded to temptation.

He was acquitted. He was never a drug dealer, and although the duress wasn't created by the DEA, they certainly exploited it to create a crime that would otherwise never have been contemplated.

Selling switchblades or weed from your stash to a cop is never entrapment. The myth that "if you're a cop, you have to tell me" has never been remotely true in Pennsylvania. I think there was a case in Oregon or Washington that said that cops can't ever make false statements to targets of investigations, but sane courts understand that police work isn't some role-playing game where there are magic spells that force your opponents to Reveal All.

[Manxdriver]

On the flip side to your reply, if asked and they didn't identify as law enforcement and then busted the drug dealer, it would be entrapment.

Maybe pagunlawyer can weigh in.

Horse shit! I remember my team of barracks lawyers in the USAF gave me extremely good info on this subject. Let me tell you, it was worth every penny I paid for it too!
" if you ask a cop if he's a cop, he can lie to you. BUT, if you ask him three times in a row if he's a cop, he HAS to show you his badge and identify himself as a cop!"


Note to the really slow members here: SARCASM GALORE!
But, yes, there really were people in the military that bought that line of thinking!

[internet troll]

Horse shit! I remember my team of barracks lawyers in the USAF gave me extremely good info on this subject. Let me tell you, it was worth every penny I paid for it too!
" if you ask a cop if he's a cop, he can lie to you. BUT, if you ask him three times in a row if he's a cop, he HAS to show you his badge and identify himself as a cop!"


Note to the really slow members here: SARCASM GALORE!
But, yes, there really were people in the military that bought that line of thinking!

Ahhh yes, the old 3 question trick.

[steve_010]

Pretty sure you can have an automatic knife as long as you posess it solely as a curio.