Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    As some of you know, I picked up five of the USMC decommissioned M45A1s. I've sold three, which means I'm a little better than even on the deal. One of the ones I have left has a brother (next number in series) on Gunbroker. I'm trying to determine if it's worth going back into the red for a larger gain down the road. I wouldn't consider it if it were common, off the shelf guns. Distributors and dealers often end up with consecutive numbers on those. This is limited to 1000 units in total. They're currently selling for about $3300 each. Would you pony up $7500 or more for two with consecutive numbers?

    Would any of you collectors out there spend more to have consecutive serial numbers of rare pieces in your collections even if these don't interest you?
    "A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself"

    "He created the game, played the game, and lost the game.... All under his own terms, by his own doing." JW34

    "Tolerance is the lube that helps slip the dildo of dysfunction into the ass of a civilized society." Plato

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    No. They are weapons. Do I appreciate them? Yes. But utility comes first. Closest I have is a Model 15 due to nostalgia. But it is also a weapon and used as such.

    I'm obviously not your target audience. But I don't think it is going to matter. The firearms are desirable but they are not exactly a collectible at this point. JMO. Put the stuff online for an elevated price and maybe you get lucky with some Mall Ninja. Email a half dozen dealers and see if anybody bites. You want them gone now, somebody out there may be thinking long term or the novelty. Probably not somebody that wants to own.
    http://forum.pafoa.org/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=5230&dateline=1441069  448

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by unclejumbo View Post
    As some of you know, I picked up five of the USMC decommissioned M45A1s. I've sold three, which means I'm a little better than even on the deal. One of the ones I have left has a brother (next number in series) on Gunbroker. I'm trying to determine if it's worth going back into the red for a larger gain down the road. I wouldn't consider it if it were common, off the shelf guns. Distributors and dealers often end up with consecutive numbers on those. This is limited to 1000 units in total. They're currently selling for about $3300 each. Would you pony up $7500 or more for two with consecutive numbers?

    Would any of you collectors out there spend more to have consecutive serial numbers of rare pieces in your collections even if these don't interest you?

    There is a much smaller collector's "market" for consecutive serialed firearms - something akin to selling two neighboring 50 acre parcels (100 acres total) with the same log cabin on each parcel (two identical log cabins included in the package). If you consider buying the two parcels from a single owner, I don't see the value as twice a single parcel - the 2nd parcel might only be 75-80% to the same purchaser negotiating to buy the two parcels, for when you buy "in size", the cost per acre must diminish due to not only the size of the purchase in dollars, but also because there are fewer individuals out there willing to monetize a package consisting of two assets - especially at 2X the price.

    I'm sure there are others who feel differently and however you sell them, I hope you find the right buyer(s), for it is easier to sell one pistol than it is to sell two at more than twice the price despite the consecutive serial numbers.

    I don't know their condition, but if you repackaged them in a single presentation case with all the cleaning brushes, a box of military ammo, etc., that may make a difference to someone for then you would have added tangible value that is clearly visible and someone may appreciate that.

    Just some thoughts....
    - bamboomaster

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    I'm not a collector but since it doesn't seem like you're having trouble selling them or even breaking even, then why not? As we all know, something is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. The serial number thing is hard to say, but there certainly is that type of mystique in the gun world. I don't buy into the serial number thing myself but there are those who do. If there is no market for the consecutive numbers down the road, but you can still make money or break even by selling seperately then why not.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by bamboomaster View Post
    There is a much smaller collector's "market" for consecutive serialed firearms - something akin to selling two neighboring 50 acre parcels (100 acres total) with the same log cabin on each parcel (two identical log cabins included in the package). If you consider buying the two parcels from a single owner, I don't see the value as twice a single parcel - the 2nd parcel might only be 75-80% to the same purchaser negotiating to buy the two parcels, for when you buy "in size", the cost per acre must diminish due to not only the size of the purchase in dollars, but also because there are fewer individuals out there willing to monetize a package consisting of two assets - especially at 2X the price.

    I'm sure there are others who feel differently and however you sell them, I hope you find the right buyer(s), for it is easier to sell one pistol than it is to sell two at more than twice the price despite the consecutive serial numbers.

    I don't know their condition, but if you repackaged them in a single presentation case with all the cleaning brushes, a box of military ammo, etc., that may make a difference to someone for then you would have added tangible value that is clearly visible and someone may appreciate that.

    Just some thoughts....
    I see what you're saying but in the minds of some buyers there is only two guns(one above and one below a given serial), just as there is only one parcel of property next door with the same cabin. Some will buy solely for the fact that they're next to each other and may pay a premium for that.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by ungawa View Post
    No. They are weapons. Do I appreciate them? Yes. But utility comes first. Closest I have is a Model 15 due to nostalgia. But it is also a weapon and used as such.

    I'm obviously not your target audience. But I don't think it is going to matter. The firearms are desirable but they are not exactly a collectible at this point. JMO. Put the stuff online for an elevated price and maybe you get lucky with some Mall Ninja. Email a half dozen dealers and see if anybody bites. You want them gone now, somebody out there may be thinking long term or the novelty. Probably not somebody that wants to own.

    I'm not trying to beat you up but it's painfully clear that you don't understand what these guns are. They're not everyone's cup of tea, I understand that, but there are lots of collectors with deep pockets who do indeed understand what these are and wouldn't bat an eye at spending $7,500 for a consecutive set. I don't think that well-heeled collector is a "mall ninja" but rather a person who realizes that an investment can be profitable whether it's in stocks, bonds, guns, artwork, or guns.

    To answer the OP, my personal opinion is that the used guns will be more highly sought after. Any of those found in consecutive pairs - especially if they are documented to have been rack mates somewhere interesting - will command a premium. But I don't think I'd take a chance on the NIB ones personally. Then again, you might hit a homer if you swing big: send the pair to Jack the Dog for example and he might get $10K for them.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by thebearpack View Post
    I'm not trying to beat you up but it's painfully clear that you don't understand what these guns are. They're not everyone's cup of tea, I understand that, but there are lots of collectors with deep pockets who do indeed understand what these are and wouldn't bat an eye at spending $7,500 for a consecutive set. I don't think that well-heeled collector is a "mall ninja" but rather a person who realizes that an investment can be profitable whether it's in stocks, bonds, guns, artwork, or guns.

    To answer the OP, my personal opinion is that the used guns will be more highly sought after. Any of those found in consecutive pairs - especially if they are documented to have been rack mates somewhere interesting - will command a premium. But I don't think I'd take a chance on the NIB ones personally. Then again, you might hit a homer if you swing big: send the pair to Jack the Dog for example and he might get $10K for them.
    I know exactly what the guns are. Perhaps you know the value better than me. So be it. When people are collecting stuff it doesn't seem to me this is the kind of stuff that comes up. But that is all I know from experience, I don't run in those circles. Steer jumbo to a good collector and help him out.

    You want to pay double for my uncle's commemorative NRA rifle? Only 500 produced. I bet I could get him to sell it to you.
    http://forum.pafoa.org/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=5230&dateline=1441069  448

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by ungawa View Post
    I know exactly what the guns are. Perhaps you know the value better than me. So be it. When people are collecting stuff it doesn't seem to me this is the kind of stuff that comes up. But that is all I know from experience, I don't run in those circles. Steer jumbo to a good collector and help him out.

    You want to pay double for my uncle's commemorative NRA rifle? Only 500 produced. I bet I could get him to sell it to you.
    Colt collectors are different than other collectors. If it's got the prancing pony, they want it. If it's rare, they really, really want it. Look what they're paying for Pythons, Troopers and Anacondas.

    These particular pistols also have more interest with USMC folks and military collectors competing with Colt collectors to get one.
    "A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself"

    "He created the game, played the game, and lost the game.... All under his own terms, by his own doing." JW34

    "Tolerance is the lube that helps slip the dildo of dysfunction into the ass of a civilized society." Plato

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by ungawa View Post
    You want to pay double for my uncle's commemorative NRA rifle? Only 500 produced. I bet I could get him to sell it to you.
    Exactly my point. Commemoratives and even limited run commercial stuff is like a Franklin Mint plate: made to be a collectible and will never be worth anything.

    These Colts - only roughly 500 of them - were never meant to be in civilian hands. That's why they doubled in value before buyers even had them in hand.

    A NIB Remington Rand is worth $3,000 all day long and there were a lot more than 500 of them. Hard to predict what these will be worth in 2-5 years, let alone 10 or more.

    UJ is in a no-lose situation. He's even now so if he invests another $4k to buy the consecutive numbered gun, he'll still only be $4k into three guns worth at a minimum $9600.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Consecutive numbered guns...are they worth more to you?

    Ok Smegal, put the ring down.

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