NJ at it again--imagine when Christie leaves?

[mikelets456]

http://www.nj2as.org/see_a_doctor_lo...m_source=nj2as

See a Doctor, Lose Your Guns: NJ Assembly Votes on Gun Bill This Thursday

This Thursday (3/23/2017) the NJ Assembly will vote on a bill that requires firearms seizure when a mental health professional determines a patient poses threat of harm to self or others. This essentially will put doctors into the very uncomfortable position of making determinations that are meant to be put before a judge. Mental health groups have also warned that the bill could cause those in need of help, to forego treatment out of fear of losing their guns for life.

The bill, A2938, would mandate that:

...a licensed practitioner of psychology, psychiatry, medicine, nursing, clinical social work, or marriage counseling who currently is providing treatment services determines, in the exercise of reasonable professional judgment, that the patient is likely to engage in conduct that would result in serious harm to self or others, the licensee shall report, as soon as practicable to the Attorney General the patient’s name and other non-clinical identifying information which the Attorney General shall only use to determine whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm.

[bogey1]

What do the PEOPLE have to say about it? Who gives a shit what the ASSembly thinks.

[tl_3237]

http://www.nj2as.org/see_a_doctor_lo...m_source=nj2as

See a Doctor, Lose Your Guns: NJ Assembly Votes on Gun Bill This Thursday

This Thursday (3/23/2017) the NJ Assembly will vote on a bill that requires firearms seizure when a mental health professional determines a patient poses threat of harm to self or others. This essentially will put doctors into the very uncomfortable position of making determinations that are meant to be put before a judge. Mental health groups have also warned that the bill could cause those in need of help, to forego treatment out of fear of losing their guns for life.

The bill, A2938, would mandate that:

...a licensed practitioner of psychology, psychiatry, medicine, nursing, clinical social work, or marriage counseling who currently is providing treatment services determines, in the exercise of reasonable professional judgment, that the patient is likely to engage in conduct that would result in serious harm to self or others, the licensee shall report, as soon as practicable to the Attorney General the patient’s name and other non-clinical identifying information which the Attorney General shall only use to determine whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm.

That paragraph was removed from the bill by amendment on 1/23/17. It now requires the local law enforcement in the patient's place of residence to determine if the patient is subject to the disqualifiers of NJSA 2C:58-3 that would temporarily void any licensures (NJFID, purchase permit, etc). Finale revocation of licensures and/or confiscation of firearms would require a Superior Court order.

Surprised that the NJ2AS article, written some two months later (3/19/17), failed to mention this significant development.

A2938 1R

[father-of-five]

This is already happening in New Jersey, through law enforcement, usually resulting in involuntary mental health commitments....and Pennsylvania. I forget the act #, but when a person is "302'd" a form gets completed and sent to Harrisburg which is reportedly put in a date base for criminal checks.

[mikelets456]

That paragraph was removed from the bill by amendment on 1/23/17. It now requires the local law enforcement in the patient's place of residence to determine if the patient is subject to the disqualifiers of NJSA 2C:58-3 that would temporarily void any licensures (NJFID, purchase permit, etc). Finale revocation of licensures and/or confiscation of firearms would require a Superior Court order.

Surprised that the NJ2AS article, written some two months later (3/19/17), failed to mention this significant development.

A2938 1R

I don't know---this part is kind of scary:

1[If a licensed practitioner of psychology, psychiatry, medicine, nursing, clinical social work, or marriage counseling who currently is providing treatment services determines, in the exercise of reasonable professional judgment, that the patient is likely to engage in conduct that would result in serious harm to self or others, the licensee shall report, as soon as practicable to the Attorney General the patient’s name and other non-clinical identifying information which the Attorney General shall only use to determine whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm. If the patient has been issued a card or permit, the Attorney General shall arrange for any firearm possessed by the patient to be seized pending a hearing. The Attorney General shall issue guidelines governing the seizure of firearms pursuant to this subsection.

[JenniferG]

People that value freedom and still live in New Jersey should seek mental health advice.

[Sparks]

And this is what their next governor could be;

http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf...ican_as_a.html

"Saturday Night Live" alum Joe Piscopo has decided he will not run for New Jersey governor as a Republican and instead is planning to declare he will jump into the race to succeed Gov. Chris Christie as an independent candidate.

Appropriate since being the governor of that state is a joke.

[tl_3237]

I don't know---this part is kind of scary:

1[If a licensed practitioner of psychology, psychiatry, medicine, nursing, clinical social work, or marriage counseling who currently is providing treatment services determines, in the exercise of reasonable professional judgment, that the patient is likely to engage in conduct that would result in serious harm to self or others, the licensee shall report, as soon as practicable to the Attorney General the patient’s name and other non-clinical identifying information which the Attorney General shall only use to determine whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm. If the patient has been issued a card or permit, the Attorney General shall arrange for any firearm possessed by the patient to be seized pending a hearing. The Attorney General shall issue guidelines governing the seizure of firearms pursuant to this subsection.

Agreed and I'm sure this is what engendered the amendment.

Note that the part enclosed within the brackets was removed and no longer part of the bill. My bolded portions indicate the involvement of the Superior Court in lieu of the original AG office as the arbiter.

e. 1[ If a licensed practitioner of psychology, psychiatry, medicine, nursing, clinical social work, or marriage counseling who currently is providing treatment services determines, in the exercise of reasonable professional judgment, that the patient is likely to engage in conduct that would result in serious harm to self or others, the licensee shall report, as soon as practicable to the Attorney General the patient’s name and other non-clinical identifying information which the Attorney General shall only use to determine whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm. If the patient has been issued a card or permit, the Attorney General shall arrange for any firearm possessed by the patient to be seized pending a hearing. The Attorney General shall issue guidelines governing the seizure of firearms pursuant to this subsection.
If the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm, or if there is information indicating that the patient otherwise may have access to a firearm, the information provided may be used in determining whether the patient has become subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3. If the chief law enforcement officer or superintendent, as appropriate, determines that the patient has become subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3, any identification card or permit issued to the patient shall be void and subject to revocation by the Superior Court in accordance with the procedure established in subsection f. of N.J.S.2C:58-3.

If the court determines that the patient is subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3 and revokes the patient’s firearms identification card in accordance with the procedure established in subsection f. of N.J.S.2C:58-3, the court may order the patient to surrender to the county prosecutor any firearm owned by or accessible to the patient and order the prosecutor to dispose of the firearms. When the court orders the county prosecutor to dispose of the firearms, the prosecutor shall dispose of the firearms as provided in N.J.S.2C:64-6.


A licensed practitioner who, in complying with this subsection, discloses a privileged communication is immune from civil liability in regard to that disclosure] In addition to complying with subsection c. of this section, a licensed practitioner shall notify the chief law enforcement officer of the municipality in which the patient resides or the Superintendent of State Police if the patient resides in a municipality that does not have a full-time police department that a duty to warn and protect has been incurred with respect to the patient and shall provide to the chief law enforcement officer or superintendent, as appropriate, the patient’s name and other non-clinical identifying information. The chief law enforcement officer or superintendent, as appropriate, shall use that information to ascertain whether the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm.

If the patient has been issued a firearms purchaser identification card, permit to purchase a handgun, or any other permit or license authorizing possession of a firearm, or if there is information indicating that the patient otherwise may have access to a firearm, the information provided may be used in determining whether the patient has become subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3. If the chief law enforcement officer or superintendent, as appropriate, determines that the patient has become subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3, any identification card or permit issued to the patient shall be void and subject to revocation by the Superior Court in accordance with the procedure established in subsection f. of N.J.S.2C:58-3.

If the court determines that the patient is subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3 and revokes the patient’s firearms identification card in accordance with the procedure established in subsection f. of N.J.S.2C:58-3, the court may order the patient to surrender to the county prosecutor any firearm owned by or accessible to the patient and order the prosecutor to dispose of the firearms. When the court orders the county prosecutor to dispose of the firearms, the prosecutor shall dispose of the firearms as provided in N.J.S.2C:64-6.

...

[mikelets456]

"If the chief law enforcement officer or superintendent, as appropriate, determines that the patient has become subject to any of the disabilities set forth in subsection c. of N.J.S.2C:58-3, any identification card or permit issued to the patient shall be void and...."

I take this as "there is NO DUE process". It seems you lose your firearm rights before you go to court....that could be days, weeks, months or years. Either way, it's [still] a grave over reach even in a court of law---it's based on a gut feeling. No crime has been committed, just the word of a politically driven left wing councilor with a hate for guns.

[RockIsland]

I'm glad that nurses and marriage counsellors will have the power to prohibit firearms ownership in the PRNJ.

This will make Newark and Camden much more safer.