Western PA Use Of Deadly Force Law Seminar

[QuackXP]

Does anyone know of any reputable law seminars on the use of deadly force that may be coming up in the Western PA area, specifically Pittsburgh?

I remember seeing these more frequently a few years ago.

[JoshIronshaft]

I think Klint was hosting recently: http://www.triggerpressersunion.com/

[chessiedog1]

I am also interested in a class like this. Like the one that was held in every May down on Banksville rd at the hotel.

[free]

Check out the F.I.R.E institute. Highly recommend.

http://www.fireinstitute.org/

[TonyF]

Check out the F.I.R.E institute. Highly recommend.

http://www.fireinstitute.org/

We don't have any presently scheduled but we probably will. Some of us have had some personal issues this year that slowed us down a bit WRT to filling our 2016 schedule. More classes are likely to be added soon.

[QuackXP]

We don't have any presently scheduled but we probably will. Some of us have had some personal issues this year that slowed us down a bit WRT to filling our 2016 schedule. More classes are likely to be added soon.

I also recall a post from someone who offered such classes (not sure if it was F.I.R.E or another instructor) than when they ran a bunch of them years ago that pretty much tapped out the market of people interested in such a class. Hopefully there is enough interest now for a new run of classes.

[PeteG]

Hello all.

The Pennsylvania Firearms Development Corporation used to do one course a year on "Pennsylvania Firearms Law," and a second focused more on the law covering self defense and the use of force, called "Pennsylvania Law Governing the Use of Deadly Force."

As Quack XP mentioned, the courses filled very quickly once or twice, then petered out. I presume it was due to the fact all the people interested in these subjects in this area (or at least the ones we can reach here and on the FIRE Institute web site) had taken the courses. I do not believe it was because the course content was not satisfactory, based upon a lot of positive feedback.

This year I have gotten a few inquiries from people asking about the courses. So it might be time to schedule another one. There have been some changes in the law that should also be covered. For example: the law on "firearms trust" just changed significantly; there are some judicial decisions that suggest the "right to bear arms," and specifically the standards discussed in District of Columbia v. Heller, is/are finally moving beyond firearms and including arms that are not guns and are severely restricted by many states (e.g. tasers; flat-slaps; automatic knives); and the message seems to be sinking in with firearms instructors that good tactics can sometimes be illegal, and we need to stop teaching students to train to commit voluntary manslaughter, 'cause they just might.

So, if there are interested people, tell me if you want the overview of the law governing the possession, use, transportation and transfer of firearms in Pa., or the more specific course on the use of force in Pa. I can schedule one in late June or July.

PeteG

[QuackXP]

Hello all.

The Pennsylvania Firearms Development Corporation used to do one course a year on "Pennsylvania Firearms Law," and a second focused more on the law covering self defense and the use of force, called "Pennsylvania Law Governing the Use of Deadly Force."

As Quack XP mentioned, the courses filled very quickly once or twice, then petered out. I presume it was due to the fact all the people interested in these subjects in this area (or at least the ones we can reach here and on the FIRE Institute web site) had taken the courses. I do not believe it was because the course content was not satisfactory, based upon a lot of positive feedback.

This year I have gotten a few inquiries from people asking about the courses. So it might be time to schedule another one. There have been some changes in the law that should also be covered. For example: the law on "firearms trust" just changed significantly; there are some judicial decisions that suggest the "right to bear arms," and specifically the standards discussed in District of Columbia v. Heller, is/are finally moving beyond firearms and including arms that are not guns and are severely restricted by many states (e.g. tasers; flat-slaps; automatic knives); and the message seems to be sinking in with firearms instructors that good tactics can sometimes be illegal, and we need to stop teaching students to train to commit voluntary manslaughter, 'cause they just might.

So, if there are interested people, tell me if you want the overview of the law governing the possession, use, transportation and transfer of firearms in Pa., or the more specific course on the use of force in Pa. I can schedule one in late June or July.

PeteG

I am defiantly interested in the "Pennsylvania Law Governing the Use of Deadly Force" and will do everything I can to work my schedule around when the class is offered as I was never able to fit it in the times it was offered and figure it would be offered indefinitely. If I could fit both courses into my schedule I would also consider retaking "Pennsylvania Firearms Law" given some of the changes that have come through.

If it makes any difference July works better for me personally. More time to plan (summer weekends fill up quick) and lots of family birthdays in June.

[PeteG]

Okay. The course will be July 30. The course name is changed. It is now "Law Governing the Use of Force in Pennsylvania." We dropped the word "deadly," because really we spend a lot of time talking about non-deadly force.

If people are interested, I can talk about the changes in the law governing "gun trusts." We will definitely talk about Second Amendment coverage of weapons other than firearms, since those are part of the constellation of laws governing the use of force.

I'm going to figure out how to post the course description where course descriptions are posted. For those who are on this thread, here it is:

LAW GOVERNING THE USE OF FORCE
IN PENNSYLVANIA

Saturday July 30, 2016 - 9:30 A.M. TO 5:00 P.M.

Holiday Inn Express Pittsburgh W. - 875 Greentree Road, Pgh. PA. 15220 (412) 922-7070
(Exit 68 off the Parkway West/I386 – Next to Parkway Center Mall)

Legally speaking, “use of force” takes many forms, which can include mere threats or even a suggestion of a threat, and the legal consequences can be life-changing. When a firearm is involved, whether fired or not, the risks and penalties go way up. The subject is complicated, technical and often misunderstood. If you think it’s as simple as “I was in fear for my life,” you are wrong. There are many other many considerations, such as how came to find himself in a position where he felt compelled to threaten or use deadly force; whether there were options to the use of such force at the moment it was applied; and how circumstances might have changed between the time a threat first became apparent and the time deadly force was actually used; whether your or your adversary enjoyed any legal privilege at the moment of confrontation. There are also practical matters of how one might best train, equip and comport himself to minimize the potential for legal problems. These considerations also extend to the use of deadly force on animals.

The Pennsylvania Firearms Development Corporation (PFDC) is presenting a six hour course of instruction for lay people who possess weapons (not limited to firearms) or study a martial art in contemplation of possibly having to use deadly force to defend themselves or their loved ones from a potentially lethal threat. The course is written by a practicing attorney who is also an experienced firearms instructor and martial artist. The course is designed to give people common-sense guidelines to help them comply with the law before, during and after an encounter involving the use of deadly force (whether a death results or not). The focus will be statutes, cases interpreting statutes, and actual case studies, and will not include political declarations or the uninformed opinions of internet bloviators.

Specific topics address will include:

• Defining and distinguishing “reasonable force” and “deadly force”
• The history of the legal defense of justification, and how it relates to “self defense.”
• A review of the statutory codification of deadly force principles in Pennsylvania.
• The “Castle Doctrine” and how the 2011 changes in the law are working out.
• Consequences of being wrong (civil and criminal exposure).
• Consequences of being right (the need to prove your case and avoid “talking your way into jail”).
• Taking the law into account when training, so as to avoid training to commit crimes.
• Circumstances affecting the lawfulness of a use of deadly force:
o Protection of self vs. protection of others vs. protection of property
o Provocation, escalation and your responsibility for a confrontation
o Use of force to make or resist an arrest
o Use of force to maintain order by those charged with the care of others
o The duty to retreat
o Issues regarding the rendering of aid following the use of deadly force.
• Your obligations in dealing with the police following an incident.
• “Prohibited” weapons and your liability for possessing them.
• Using deadly force against animals (excluding hunting and the Game Code).

Instructors: PETER GEORGIADES is a practicing attorney with four decades years of litigation experience. Admitted to practice in Arizona, Pennsylvania and the District of Columbia, his practice includes advising clients with respect to various aspects of law relating to firearms. Peter has been an instructor in law at the National Law Center at the George Washington University and the Graduate School of Industrial Administration at Carnegie-Mellon University, and is also an experienced firearms instructor (NRA certified to instruct in rifle, pistol, shotgun and personal protection; issued State of Arizona CCW instructor certificate No. 8769268; member of the International Ass'n. of Law Enforcement Firearms Instructors (IALEFI); and instructor in carbine and defensive tactics since 1997). Peter is a judoka, holding the rank of Sandan (3rd Degree Black Belt), is a two-time medalist at the USA Senior National Judo Championships (2005 and 2007), and gold medalist at USJA PA state open (2009, 2011).

HARRY SCHNEIDER is the Legislative Chairman of the Pennsylvania Sportsmen's Association (PSA). He is experienced at writing bills and analyzing legislation, and has been active in the advancement of the interests of firearms owners in the Pennsylvania. His work includes assistance in writing and passing amendments to firearms laws in Pennsylvania, including statutes governing reciprocity and the 2011 amendments to the statutes governing the use of deadly force. He has attended numerous ATF-PSP Firearms Law Seminars and seminars sponsored by the Pennsylvania Bar Institute, the Federal Bar Association and the NRA. His formal firearms training and experience stretches back 30 years.

Cost: The cost is $100.

Course format: The course will consist of straightforward explanation of what the governing statutes provide, how the law works, what the current rules are and how to stay out of unnecessary trouble. There will be three hours of discussion in the morning and three hours in the afternoon, with a one-hour break for lunch, and 15 minute breaks in the morning and in the afternoon. The course will run from 9:30 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. There will be substantial time for questions and discussion.

Prerequisites: Because this course does not involve the handling of weapons or training in the actual application of force, no criminal history check is required, and no age limits apply.

CONTINUING LEGAL EDUCATION CREDITS: 6 hours of continuing education credit for NRA law enforcement instructor accreditation. Paperwork will be will be available at the course site.

TO ENROLL:

Download an enrollment form at www.fireinstitute.org, or

Send a letter giving your name and contact information, and a check or money order for $100, payable to “Pennsylvania Firearms Development Corporation.” Mail your check and application to “PFDC, 1712 East Carson Street – First Floor, Pittsburgh, PA 15203.” You will receive an enrollment confirmation by return mail. Enrollment is first-come/first-served.

Be sure to give your address and a phone number, so we can send you the course confirmation, and contact you in case of a change or cancellation.

[Everready73]

State Rep Carl Metzgar is having a free seminar in friedens ,PA right by Somerset this Wednesday from 7-9 at the National Gaurd Armory covering concealed carry and castle doctrine. Check out website for info repmetzgar.com .