Traffic stop. Legally owned firearm confiscated.

[steve_010]

I fucking hate this shit

I've been practicing my answers in the form of questions:

PO: Do you have any weapons in the car?
Me: What is the reason for this traffic stop again, sir?

or

PO: Do you have any weapons in the car?
Me: NONE OF YOUR FUCKING BUSINESS! (j/k that won't go over well)

[adalwulf222]

Gummy, thanks. I put a fair amount of info in my original post to show that I was cooperative, honest, and not trying to hide anything. In a round about way, the officers explained that it was the fact that I had 4 firearms in total in the car and two were loaded in my glove compartment. Unfortunately there is a stigma attached to firearms and they are seen as bad or evil. I would not expect that kind of attitude from people who use firearms in their line of work. Since a young age I have always felt a responsibility to be armed. That feeling has been intensified since a combat deployment with the Army in 2004-2005. I was very uncomfortable handing over a legally owned and used firearm to a LEO.

I'm going this afternoon to get my gun back.

[JcBook47]

I really hope you keep us updated on this situation.

http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.ph...=15#post298674

This link is for the 2008 OC dinner @ The Old Country Buffet in Dickson City 5/9 thread. It starts on page 15. I've read the first 1500 post until I decided to skip to the end. In that PA Patriot had a handgun confiscated until he proved proof of ownership. I believe it was discussed in length that it wasn't on him to prove ownership. As a LTCF holder I can lend my firearm to other LTCF holders and they can carry it.

I feel there is a little more to the long story you skipped over, I would make sure you have it all written down so when you talk to the lawyer you have everything there and are not missing any details.

Again I'm not a lawyer but I do believe you would have some sort of case, especially if you had to wait for another officer to show up until they searched your car. I think the Rodriguez V United States case may apply here, I'm not sure if it implies but I think it might. I know that court case has to do with a K-9 unit looking for drugs nut from what I have read on the ruling it can be interpreted to extend to waiting for back-up to do a search.

[adalwulf222]

Steve, I agree. I have always tried to respect the law enforcement officers that I come in contact with and this experience was unlike any I have had before. I will defend and use my rights to the best of my ability while trying not to come across as a douche.

Does anyone know if I can get additional help from another LE agency (Sheriff or State Police) when I feel that I am not being treated properly?

[steve_010]

Steve, I agree. I have always tried to respect the law enforcement officers that I come in contact with and this experience was unlike any I have had before.

Respect does not mean you must trust someone. Police are humans and all humans are capable of evil. This cop was looking to write a ticket, arrest someone, or confiscate something whether it was legal or not. The less information you give an officer, the less of a chance it can be used against you.

[adalwulf222]

Believe me, this experience has opened my eyes. It is truly unfortunate because I haven't had an issue like this before. This cop makes the job harder for other LEO because now I will be much less apt to offer info.

[Carson]

This. I would get a lawyer. A good one. At the very least talk to Phil Kkine, who is a member here & a outstanding asset to this forum. Gunlawyer001. If he can not help, he can direct you.

IMO, they illegal stole your pistol, recept or not. A firearms registry is illegal in PA. Using the "data base" as probable cause to take your property because it was not registered, is unlawful & a violation of due process but also section 21 of the Commonwealth Consitution. In addition, as you already had a bill of sale for one firearm not in the "database" a reasonable person would assume the same of the other one IMO.

The courts ruled it was not an illegal registry because it was not complete (due to out of State guns, guns passed between family, & so on). As such it can not be used as proable cause to seize your property.

Like I said. Get. A. Lawyer.

Sue them into the ground. Demand every officer in the deptment attend their entire police course again, with additional studies in US & Penna Consitutional Law. Ask that they be required to follow the court rulings vs the city of Philly in regard to firearms. Hell, ask for an injection on them engaging in any contact with presumable my lawful firearms owners & require them to defer interactions to PSP or the local Constibles as they have shown a willful & wanton disregard for the laws, tr. Consitution of the Commonwealth, of these United States & of basic human rights.

Ask for suspension of immunity, & criminal charges for theft, as no person who knew the law could have believed their actions were legal & 800 years of legal precident requires officers of the law to know the law.

I am not sure how this would apply to his situation.

[normanvin]

Might I ask which PD this was?

[adalwulf222]

Avoca

[normanvin]

Avoca

Nice. A few towns over from me.