Harrington& Richardson S&W 38 CTGE Breaktop Revolver- Worth/Safe to shoot? Any info?

[OldKingKibitzer]

Looking for some info on a Harrington and Richardson 38 S&W break top...Any thoughts? Can it shoot modern .38 S&W or only blackpowder? (I know it's OLD!) How can I tell if it will shoot safely? Any ideas of how much it is worth? Age? Any info would be greatly appreciated!! I poked around on some other forums, found info for a few different models but not one exactly like this...It has a 6 digit serial number, no letters in front of the numbers.

[OldKingKibitzer]

OK! So after searching google for a few hours, I finally came to the conclusion it was made between 1913-1915 (see http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/thre...-w-ctge.75244/ for reference, very helpful) BUT Does anyone know the value of these guys? Still not seeing much out there. Is it shootable? It is rated for smokeless, but how can I tell if it is safe to shoot?

[raxar]

Value is minimal, $100 would be shooting for the moon. As long as it still locks up and doesn't have a lot of play in the cylinder it should be OK to shoot. .38 s&w factory ammo is not going to be hot at all but it will be pretty expensive. You can load your own with .38 spl dies and bullets, and you could cut down .38 spl brass. Accuracy will most likely be pretty bad

[Ecclectic Collector]

Please don't use .38 special brass. The case dimension of the .38 S&W is wider at the base and is not compatible.

Maj. George Nonte in his book Cartridge Conversions pointed out that .38 S&W is dimensionally identical to the 9mm parabellum and he said using standard 9mm dies with a shell holder for a rimmed cartridge.

Indeed that is what I do and it has worked in practice for me for nearly 20 years. Never had a problem with cases splitting or damaged a revolver. Keep in mind all the reloading manuals caution to keep your load charges at the bottom of the tables as that style of top break action is notoriously prone to wearing out the latch.

On the other hand, not sure how .38 S&W is more expensive than .38 special. Both are running around $20+ a box these days for factory loaded ammo. Smaller, local shops tend to carry it. You can also order ammo on-line with places like Graf and Sons (grafs.com).

[MOUNTAINORACLE]

I have that guns twin and have been shooting mine a couple of times a year for more years than a want to remember. I believe my grand dad gave it me in 56 or 57 (damn it been nearly 60 years)

[indianjack]

Value is minimal, $100 would be shooting for the moon. As long as it still locks up and doesn't have a lot of play in the cylinder it should be OK to shoot. .38 s&w factory ammo is not going to be hot at all but it will be pretty expensive. You can load your own with .38 spl dies and bullets, and you could cut down .38 spl brass. Accuracy will most likely be pretty bad

I have a S&W lemon Squeezer from that era in 38 S&W. Shoots fine, and I found a deal on Mag-tech 38 S&W ammo, so the ammo can be found.

[Dave_n]

Can very easily reload 38 S&W. The current commercial load is a very anemic 146 grain FMJ. The UK's 380/200 was equivalent to the Colt Police load. I load 38 S&W cases (Starline) with 180 grain lead flat point at 0.360 (made for me by Roger's Better Bullets in King of Prussia, I usually order 2500 heads at a time). Can load these to give 650 fps which is POA at 7 yds in my old SW M&P 1904 onwards series of old revolvers, the Victory Models made for the UK forces in WWII, Webley Mk IV and Enfield Pistol No 2 Mks 1-1**. Buy the 38 S&W dies from Lee. Do not use 38 Special cases since as mentioned above they are dimensionally smaller in diameter and will split. Dave_n

[Boondox]

Value is minimal, $100 would be shooting for the moon.

I believe I have seen one of these in a not as good condition being sold by different people at different times online in PA and asking price was always $100.00

[knight0334]

The roll-stamp on top of the barrel determines the model and variation, which in turn determines the year, or range of years it was made. The patent dates, and/or the spelling of the state, are factors used to figure that out. With exception of a couple variations of the 2nd Model's letters in the serial numbers, serial numbers themselves on pre-1940 H&R mean nothing.

If you want to know for sure which variation it is - either take a good picture of that top roll stamp or type it out EXACTLY as it is stamped and I can tell you in 2 minutes which variation it is. (I can tell you already that it is a H&R "Automatic Ejecting, 3rd Model")

With it having the caliber stamped on the side means it is a smokeless gun, most typically made after 1904. (there were a few smokeless pre-1905 guns made for testing and sales)

Use .38S&W dies. The .38S&W is a larger diameter cartridge that shoots a .361" bullet. Whereas the .38Colt family cartridges(.38S&W Special, .357Mag, .360DW, .357Mag, .357SuperMag) all use .357" to .358" bullets.

.38S&W ammo is available, and I have an easier time finding it that I do .22LR. Remington, Magtech, and Fiocchi all load it today. (I recommend Remington)