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Thread: Equipment To Load 223
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February 25th, 2015, 02:31 PM #11
Re: Equipment To Load 223
When I started I sorted by 5.56 and .223, then I sorted the .223 into a pile with primer pocket crimp and those without. The .223 without primer pocket crimps will be the least amount of prep work, so I loaded those first.
I never bothered to sort different head stamps in those piles, because if you're shooting for combat accuracy out of an AR, then you won't see a reward for the extra work.
Now, I don't sort anything. I have a load that's safe and functional for all brass and I swage all primer pockets.
I took 15 different headstamp cases (mix of 5.56 and .223), sample 1 of each, filled each with a water 5 times, and each time measured the volume, trying to be as consistent as possible. What I found was that the volume range was so wide for .223 that all 5.56 was encompassed in it, so now I don't believe you can't load 5.56 with the same charge you use for .223 and that lead me to decide on my moderate load I use for all brass.
I can't view ar15.com at work, but if you google "arfcom case lube" the first three results are what you need to read.
I don't worry about the insides. A little bit will hit some of the case mouths when I mist them all twice. This does get transferred to the surfaces in the die. If you're getting sticking, do something different.
Yes, it deprimes with the decapping rod is installed in the center, you can run it without but I haven't found a reason I ever would. You'll get different responses on the small base die, my opinion is no, others will disagree, do some research on Brian Enos forum, The High Road forum, or somewhere else for more opinions.
If you have the handheld deburrer like the Lyman Case Prep Multi Tool, then a quick twist with it on both ends will clean up your case mouth. It doesn't take much.
I don't like disturbing my die settings. You could get a really cheap single stage press to set up the swaging die in, but I would look at the Dillon Super Swage 600 or other options.
Case gauge can be used multiple times in the process to ensure you're never moving brass around, but most importantly you want it for after full length sizing to make sure your die is set right. Trim shouldn't move the case shoulder, unless you have a trimmer with a sizing die like the Dillon Rapid Trim electric trimmer, but it's a good way to check the finish trim dimension and verify your caliper reading. I check a couple, then do a couple hundred, check a few more, etc. This comes down to personal preference and how capable your equipment is.
I don't know how the Lee primes, I would think you would need a hand held case primer. My Dillon primes on the down stroke. There is also an RSBC ram priming die. This could justify the purchase of a single stage press for that swaging die mentioned earlier.
I use calipers for final cartridge OAL.
I was surprised how useful a cheap powder funnel was after I got one, if you don't have one already.In America arms are free merchandise such that anyone who has the capital may make their houses into armories and their gardens into parks of artillery. - Ira Allen, 1796
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February 25th, 2015, 03:28 PM #12Grand Member
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Re: Equipment To Load 223
What is your budget for a trimmer?
Personally I would go powered, rather than hand crank.
After resizing I do not bother to check length of brass. I have my world's finest trimmer set exactly to the length I want and then run every piece through. If the brass is already short enough then the trimmer will not touch it.
You can buy bench mounted swagers from Dillon and RCBS if you don't want to do it on the press. I don't do reaming because that's an area of the brass I don't want to be messing around with in terms of taking off too much material.
A lot of people have figured out ways to bang out all rifle ammo in one go on a progressive, but realistically for most people you need to break it down into 2 separate operations.
1. Case prep which will consist of cleaning, resizing, trimming, chamfering, deburring, primer pocket swaging and cleaning. I also find after all that you've got brass trimmings and lube, so the brass ends up needing to be cleaned again.
When done with all that you have put the brass back into spec and "like new".
2. Reloading which will consist of installing a new primer, powder, seating the bullet and crimping as you desire. I finish with a quality control check with a case gauge and visual inspection.
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February 25th, 2015, 03:29 PM #13
Re: Equipment To Load 223
Easy spray lube here: http://www.ak47.net/forums/t_6_42/285694_.html
All full length dies will size the outer case body & have a decapping pin with an expander ball. You don't need to pull any of that unless you get into making match ammo & are using bushing dies & turning necks etc. You'll be fine with a Lee 223/556 full length die, but if you decide to get the RCBS small base, that's fine too. It's just made to make sure your brass fits any AR chamber easily.
For primer crimps, you can actually use the reamer from your Lyman tool - that's the one with all the little different pieces that screw into the body housing right? You can chuck the reamer into a drill & go over the cases with a primer crimp & you should be good. If primers are hard to seat, keep trying or get a swage setup.
Trimming is pretty important because all this work on the brass makes it "grow". You're not making match ammo, but you do want to have your neck tension on the bullet as similar as possible in each case. Also, if you never trim, eventually you'll have a hard time chambering as the neck gets out of spec. I have used a cheap Lee trimmer that trimmed too short & was a royal PITA. Lee makes some good stuff, but their cheap trimming tool is not very good. I have a L.E. Wilson trimmer, which is very accurate, but can be a bit slow. I would have to say for loading like this, you really won't find a better trimmer than Little Crow Gunwork's "World's Finest Trimmer" or WFT for short. The drawback on this trimmer is that it's a bit pricey for a single caliber trimmer. But, that little bit of extra $$ up front saves literally hours & hours of case prep time when doing a bunch of rifle brass.
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February 25th, 2015, 03:30 PM #14
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February 25th, 2015, 04:45 PM #15
Re: Equipment To Load 223
Don't make too many rounds on your first attempt - less to pull apart if you did it wrong. You might choose to make 5 to 10 at a single powder charge 5% to 10% (eg 7%) below max for whatever powder/bullet you choose, go to the range, and check for function. If successful, fine. If not go back and make changes to your process. Then make rounds at different powder charge levels, working up, and test them at the range at the same time for accuracy (and function). Then choose a load and make more on your 3rd or 4th session.
GLHF and stay safe.Last edited by Twoboxer; February 25th, 2015 at 04:58 PM.
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February 25th, 2015, 05:48 PM #16Grand Member
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Re: Equipment To Load 223
I like small base FL sizing for the AR series. I used Redding 223 dies. I routinely used mil spec brass.
Dillon spray on Lube is great for fast and easy sizing.
I also used a carbide expander button. This eliminated the need for internal lubrication.
The AR requires high port pressures to reliably function.
For the AR series I found best results with ball propellants. I used BL-C2, WC844 or 748. They all work well. They meter like water.
Single base propellants will work well. They are not as progressive as the double base ball propellants. They do not meter as smoothly as the ball propellants.
I am not conversant with newer generation propellants.
I've never had a problem with "soft" primers in the AR 15. The firing pin floats but is not heavy. Others may have different experiences.Last edited by GeneCC; February 26th, 2015 at 05:45 PM.
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February 25th, 2015, 08:53 PM #17Active Member
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Re: Equipment To Load 223
A lot of great advice here. I would like to chime in with my 2cents. I don't know what powder you are planning to use but I found that if you use an extruded [rod] powder instead of a ball powder it can ''bridge'' in the case mouth and cause spilling and inaccurate filling because the case mouth is too small. I was using IMR4895 and had problems on a progressive. Switched to a ball powder and all is good.
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February 25th, 2015, 09:01 PM #18Active Member
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Re: Equipment To Load 223
as others have stated, if you use military brass you will have to swage it to get primer into the primer pocket.
i always full size my ar15 brass to ensure proper chambering/cycling/extracting.
not necessary but i have a larry willis chamber gage that i use to bump the shoulder on my ar15 brass back .004, and all my bolt gun brass to .002
that way your not stretching the brass and fatiguing it prematurely.
i use old fashioned rcbs lube and lube pad, i roll the case on the pad and then i press the rim of the cartridge into the lube pad to lube the rim of cartridge.
i use a hand crank..but i do all my reloading in the winter and do all my shooting in the summer..except for hunting of course.
with spray lube you must spray entire case or you will be getting very familiar with a case extractor. never had much luck with spray lubes..
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February 25th, 2015, 10:32 PM #19Grand Member
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Re: Equipment To Load 223
The Dillon spray lube is awesome. I take a plastic bin filled with some brass, spray a few pumps in on the brass, mix it in good by hand, spray a few more if need be. It does a great job coating everything and haven't had any problems since going to it.
I've used a lube pad and Redding case wax. Works fine but much slower and tedious. I don't have the problem with it for small quantities but for doing bulk ammo, no.
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February 25th, 2015, 10:40 PM #20Active Member
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Re: Equipment To Load 223
very true..if your reloading in bulk then that would be the way to go.
i did try rcbs spray lube and it worked pretty good but it was nearly $10 a bottle.
hornady spray i did not have much luck with, cases would keep wanting to get stuck in the sizer die.Last edited by usmc21; February 25th, 2015 at 10:42 PM.
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