Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Question Small Pistol CC Questions

    Mods: I'm not sure if this question should be in the Pistol forum or the CC/OC forum, so feel free to move this.

    I currently carry a full-size M&P9, and I love that gun. It's perfectly balanced, comfortable to shoot, and I'm pretty accurate with it. That said, I don't carry nearly as much as I should. Why? Being a full-size pistol, it weighs 24oz empty (probably close to twice that with 17 rounds of 9mm on board) with an overall length of 7.5in and an overall height of 5.5in. I tend to have to wear my belt pretty tight just to keep the gun on my hip, and even with an IWB holster, the gun's grip prints in most of my "everyday" clothes.

    I know that I should be carrying as much as possible, which is why I have decided that my next purchase is going to be a small, light pistol that better fits my lifestyle. I am looking into either a snub-nose revolver (e.g. S&W J-Frame) or a sub-compact auto (e.g. Ruger LCP). I believe that either of these types of pistols would be super-easy to carry on a belt or in a cargo pocket. Before I make my choice, though, I have a number of questions about these types of pistols.

    Snub-nose Revolvers:
    I have zero experience with revolvers. I've mainly been looking at DAO .38 specials with fully concealed hammers. The reason for this is that the idea of an exposed hammer makes me nervous. Given the small capacity of these revolvers (5 or 6 shots), I'd carry it will all cylinders full. To my knowledge, that means the hammer will be resting on a loaded cylinder. What happens if an exposed hammer catches on something and gets pulled back and snaps forward before it locks back? My fear is that the revolver could accidentally go off in that situation. Is there something about the operation of a revolver that makes that situation impossible? I'm also thinking that the availability of SA in a CC revolver may be a non-issue because I don't think I'd be worrying about pulling a hammer back if I found myself in a gunfight.

    Sub-compact Autos:
    These pistols are downright tiny. The Ruger LCP weighs only 9.4oz with an overall length of 5.16in and an overall height of 3.6in. Because of their small dimensions and tiny girth, I worry about how controllable such a pistol would be (even in .380 auto). I would say that I have fairly large mitts, so I'm worried about how well I'd be able grip such a small pistol. Does anyone have any insight on this issue? If they are controllable, I do like how ultra-compact they are and how they generally offer greater round capacity than the snubbies.

    I know that most of you are going to tell me that I should go to a shop and put some guns in my hand to answer some of these questions; don't worry, I am planning on doing that. I just wanted to gather some initial insight from the very knowledgeable people on this forum.

    Thanks in advance!
    Last edited by lexington86; June 29th, 2008 at 03:14 PM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    Most modern revolvers have a transfer bar system, which keeps the hammer from hitting the firing pin unless the trigger is pulled. Such a system keeps the gun from firing if something should snag the hammer then let it snap forward.

    Since you are so pleased with your M&P, have you checked out the compact version to see if it would meet your needs? Cathy loves her M&P 9c, just like you love your full sized version. So much so that she's actually considering going the reverse direction you are, namely getting a full sized M&P9 for times when a full sized gun is feasible.
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    Not an expert, you might try to decide what is the smallest caliber/power you are willing accept first. Then finding the easiest carry firearm next.

    .380 is limited compared to .38 spl

    2 cents.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    I've got a Kel-tec P3AT. It is a handful to shoot. Even though it's a .380 caliber, it packs some serious recoil due to it's light weight. It can be painful to shoot after 20 rounds. I don't enjoy it, but thene again I didn't get it for that. It's light and easy to CC. That's why I got it.

    My advice would be to go and fondle...er handle a few at the gun store.
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  5. #5
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by PisnNapalm View Post
    I've got a Kel-tec P3AT. It is a handful to shoot. Even though it's a .380 caliber, it packs some serious recoil due to it's light weight. It can be painful to shoot after 20 rounds. I don't enjoy it, but thene again I didn't get it for that. It's light and easy to CC. That's why I got it.

    i shot miy P3AT for the first time last week; jeez, it hurt! but it's reliable, and accurate for its size.

    if caliber is an issue, you might want to look into keltec's PF9. it's probably the smallest 9mm, next to a rohrbaugh, but it's about a zillion dollars cheaper. my brother bought his last winter; he wears it IWB and in a pocket holster, depending on what he's wearing. like the P3AT, it kicks like bruce lee, but it's very, very accurate, and it's been reliable. here's a photo for size comparison.

    from the top, clockwise: commander sized Llama .45ACP, Haskell/HiPoint .45ACP, Keltec PF9, S&W Sigma 9VE, Cobra Enterprises CA380
    Last edited by jahwarrior72; June 29th, 2008 at 06:00 PM.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    50 rounds through my P3AT ripped skin on the web of my thumb. It kicks harder than my .45, or atleast feels like it does.
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    I have, and cc both. A Glock 30 in an IWB holster, and a Colt Agent .38 spc snub nose in a pocket holster. It gives me options depending on what I'm doing, what I'm wearing, the weather, etc. If you're planning on an IWB holster, I wouldn't recommend a revolver, kind of thick in a self defense caliber. If you want to pocket carry, either are good options when combined with a good holster.

    I wouldn't base your ultimate decision on the snagged hammer issue. I can't explain the mechanics of it like JW did, but for my own peace of mind I tested my Colt extensively to see if the firing pin would strike the primer if the hammer was accidentally released while either pulling it back into SA position, or while returning it to DA by pulling the trigger while holding back the hammer. My motivation for the experiment was to see if in a panicky, sweaty palms situation where I cocked the hammer for SA firing, and then went to stand down, could my thumb slip and cause a ND. What I finally was able to convince myself was that if my finger was not pulling the trigger, the firing pin would not strike the primer. Even if I pulled the hammer all the way back, pulled the trigger to release it with my thumb on the hammer, and then let go of the trigger and hammer at the same time. Obviously this is just one of a bazillion models of DA revolvers, but it's something to consider if your looking for one.

    I think the only viable solution is to buy one of each. Carry the sem-auto while you're getting used to the wheel gun, and then when you're comfy with it, you have a BUG.
    Last edited by str8shooter; June 29th, 2008 at 06:52 PM.
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  8. #8
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by jahwarrior72 View Post
    i shot miy P3AT for the first time last week; jeez, it hurt! but it's reliable, and accurate for its size.

    if caliber is an issue, you might want to look into keltec's PF9. it's probably the smallest 9mm, next to a rohrbaugh, but it's about a zillion dollars cheaper. my brother bought his last winter; he wears it IWB and in a pocket holster, depending on what he's wearing. like the P3AT, it kicks like bruce lee, but it's very, very accurate, and it's been reliable. here's a photo for size comparison.
    You have me really interested in the PF9. It's smaller than the snubbies and weighs less too. I'd also be able to use my existing 9mm and only buy one caliber in the future. What does your brother say about his?

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    I tried a J frame revolver and didn't like shooting it, too much recoil for me, the thought of a lot of shooting to be proficient had no appeal, I carry an XD 9 SC during the winter and a Bersa .380 for summer carry, both fit me, (I'm short and broad) and the Bersa fits well with a IWB holster & shirt over it. I like the ease of a semi auto trigger.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Small Pistol CC Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by lexington86 View Post
    You have me really interested in the PF9. It's smaller than the snubbies and weighs less too. I'd also be able to use my existing 9mm and only buy one caliber in the future. What does your brother say about his?
    my brother loves it. he carries it everywhere; he's even fallen asleep with it IWB. he's a hardcore fan of big wheelguns, like the Raging Bull and the Ruger Redhawk, but he only ever carries the Keltec. he's gotten used to the recoil now, and he can shoot under 3" at 20 yds. i didn't think something so small could be that accurate, but it is. if i ever need another pocketgun, that will be the one.

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