Define "concealed".

[WoodsyHowl]

USLegal.com offers this: "Definition of concealed. A firearm or dangerous weapon is concealed if it is carried in such a manner as to not be discernible by the ordinary observation of a passerby. There is no requirement [in its example of state law] that there be absolute invisibility of the firearm or dangerous weapon, merely that it not be ordinarily discernible."

Is a handgun carried in a leather holster with a flap that when closed hides the entire weapon, as with makarovs and old Colt 1911s in their original military issue holsters that enclose the entire sidearm, a concealed handgun?

"Ordinary observation" by a passerby would probably conclude that what's behind the leather flap must be a handgun even though the handgun is "invisible".

Conversely, such a holster without a handgun inside would also be surmised by a passerby as being a handgun, even though there is no gun, and that would seem to make carrying an empty holster such as that illegal.

[knight0334]

That definition of "concealed" would probably be what a judge would use for PA.

However for the empty flap holster - that wouldnt' fly in PA. PA requires that an actual "firearm" be concealed on or about ones person.

[Rosco the Iroc]

I don't see this thread going anywhere.

[tlnzz1]

Find the word concealed on your PA LTCF.

[Deleted]

Here is what the courts have said about "Concealed"....

“Our interpretation of the statute under consideration is that the issue of concealment depends upon the particular circumstances present in each case, and is a question for the trier of fact.”
- Commonwealth v. Butler, 150 A.2d 172, 173 (Pa.Super. 1959).

Then there is Comm v. Williams.....

"As he rounded the corner of Harlan onto 22nd Street he observed appellant firing a long-barrelled, jet black hand-gun at a fast-moving tan Cadillac. After the Cadillac turned a corner appellant then held the gun to his side and began to walk. Johnson proceeded to his automobile, which was parked on 22nd Street and drove to the corner where he stopped for a red light. At the corner Johnson saw appellant pull a gun, which was apparently the same gun he had seen appellant firing at the tan Cadillac. Appellant then walked over to the corner, about fifteen feet from Johnson, and began to spin the gun and toss it from one hand to the other. As the light turned green appellant stuck the gun in his belt, turned around and walked away."

Williams was charged with, among other things, carrying a firearm without a license...

“In the instant case there is no evidence whatsoever as to any attempt by appellant to conceal any weapon; and, therefore, we must conclude that the evidence was insufficient to sustain appellant's conviction as to Section 6106.”
- Commonwealth v. Williams, 346 A.2d 308, 310 (Pa.Super. 1975).


Testimony of two witnesses that they saw the actor pull from his waistband something that looked like a gun was sufficient to prove concealment. - Commonwealth v. Scott, 436 A.2d 607 (Pa. 1981).

Actor was directing traffic in a parking lot when an officer observed a firearm “in a holster at his waist,” evidence was sufficient to uphold concealment element. - Commonwealth v. Bavusa, 750 A.2d 855 (Pa. Super. 2000)

(Both of these cases cite the Butler ruling from 1959)


In a nutshell.... "Concealed" will depend on the particular facts surrounding the event. Hope all that helps!!!

[donotknowme]

Find the word concealed on your PA LTCF.

It's on the back near the left side.

[knight0334]

Find the word concealed on your PA LTCF.

The name on a permit or license means nothing. The primary necessity of a LTCF is for concealment.

No license or permit from any state requires a person to conceal - only the law does if open carry is prohibited - which there are only a handful of states that prohibit open carry whether licensed or not.

[tlnzz1]

It's on the back near the left side.

It must just be missing from mine.

[donotknowme]

It must just be missing from mine.

I can write it on yours like I did on mine if you like.

[tlnzz1]

I can write it on yours like I did on mine if you like.

Yes, please do.