Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Here is a link to the thread on Open Carry (dot) Org:

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...-in-Swissvalle

    Open Carry win in Swissvalle

    Went grocery shopping at the Giant Eagle in Swissvalle Pa the other day and I was stopped by the store security/Pa constable. He told me that the store owner's/manager did not allow firearms. (this was not a corporate store) He said I could put it in my car and continue shopping. I declined and said it could be stolen. He said I could conceal it and continue. I then said you said I could not be there period with a firearm concealed or open. He got confused and said that I can stay if I cover it. I shopped and left. I contacted the home office and the store manager and was informed there was no such policy. The store manager informed me he would inform the security/constable that they had no such policy and I was welcome to shop there.
    Here is the follow-up, and the part that concerns me about the Constable's behavior...

    Q: Was he a Constable?

    That is what his uniform patches said and his badge said. Still do not know exactly what a constable is. But he was acting as store security. I watched him punch out at the time clock as I was leaving.
    Is it appropriate for a Constable to wear the badges, patches and "uniform" (is there a uniform for a PA Constable?) while privately employed outside the scope of his/her duties as a Constable? It seems to me I've heard of LEOs doing this under certain circumstances so it wouldn't really surprise me. But I still found this account to be interesting and thought I would pass it along under this section.

    So if you find yourself wandering about the Swissvale area, watch out! It seems we have a confused Constable on the loose, and he doesn't seem to hesitate in spreading his confusion under color of authority, whatever authority Constables have anyway.

    Swissvale is a borough in Allegheny County, Pennsylvania, 9 miles east of downtown Pittsburgh.
    .
    While many claim to support the right, precious few support the practice.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    He would need to be Act 235 certified, since he's basically a private security guard with a few brownie points.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Was this the Giant Eagle in Edgewood Towne Center? If so, yes he is a constable...one that is on a serious power trip though. You should see the guys car...

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Quote Originally Posted by scruff View Post
    He would need to be Act 235 certified, since he's basically a private security guard with a few brownie points.

    I aware of this under other circumstances or for other people, but are you saying the whatever certifications and qualifications might be required to be a constable, ACT 235 would also be required here. That his being a constable wouldn't be enough?

    Additionally, there is no mention in the other thread as to whether or not the constable was armed at the time.
    While many claim to support the right, precious few support the practice.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Quote Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
    I aware of this under other circumstances or for other people, but are you saying the whatever certifications and qualifications might be required to be a constable, ACT 235 would also be required here. That his being a constable wouldn't be enough?

    Additionally, there is no mention in the other thread as to whether or not the constable was armed at the time.
    As I understand it, even LEOs must be Act 235 to moonlight armed. I suspect however that their LEO training would suffice to get a waiver to most of the Act 235 training but they still need the PSP Commissioner's perfunctory certification. Whether Constables would similarly qualify is unknown but I think it safe to say that they still need the certification.

    37 Pa Code § 21.2. Mandatory certification.

    Privately employed agents, regardless of their place of residence or employers’ location who, as an incidence to their employment, carry a lethal weapon within this Commonwealth. Training schools or instructors shall be certified by the Commissioner prior to engaging in any activity which is regulated by the act.

    § 21.3. Law enforcement officers.

    A law enforcement officer or other peace officer of this Commonwealth who performs activities which are regulated by the act and receives a form of compensation, gift, donation, or gratuity for these services, from a private person, association, or corporation, shall be deemed to be a privately employed agent.

    § 21.14. Waiver of training.

    A person who has completed a course of instruction in a training program approved by the Commissioner may request a waiver of the academic or firearms training provisions in accordance with the following:

    (1) Academic waiver. The applicant must have successfully completed a formal course of instruction comparable to the academic course prescribed by the Commissioner, within 5 years prior to receipt of the application by the Department. The applicant must have the verified waiver certificate on the application form completed by the certifying official.

    (2) Firearms waiver. The applicant must have successfully completed a formal combat firearms course of instruction comparable to the firearms course prescribed by the Commissioner, within 1 year prior to receipt of the application by the Department. The applicant must have the verified waiver certificate on the application form completed by the certifying official.
    IANAL

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Quote Originally Posted by tl_3237 View Post
    As I understand it, even LEOs must be Act 235 to moonlight armed. I suspect however that their LEO training would suffice to get a waiver to most of the Act 235 training but they still need the PSP Commissioner's perfunctory certification. Whether Constables would similarly qualify is unknown but I think it safe to say that they still need the certification.

    Interesting, and thanks for the cites. Anyway, there is nothing in the original report to suggest the constable was armed at the time, only uniformed, with badge and patches indicating PA Constable.
    While many claim to support the right, precious few support the practice.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Quote Originally Posted by doc4020 View Post
    Was this the Giant Eagle in Edgewood Towne Center? If so, yes he is a constable...one that is on a serious power trip though. You should see the guys car...
    Get a picture for us!

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    I don't think there is a "standard uniform" for PA constables. Seems to be whatever they want to wear.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Quote Originally Posted by HiredGoon View Post
    I don't think there is a "standard uniform" for PA constables. Seems to be whatever they want to wear.
    The only thing I've seen in common about PA constables is their 300+ lb weight.
    Rules are written in the stone,
    Break the rules and you get no bones,
    all you get is ridicule, laughter,
    and a trip to the house of pain.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Do any PA Constables want to weigh in on this one?

    Quote Originally Posted by streaker69 View Post
    The only thing I've seen in common about PA constables is their 300+ lb weight.
    And that's all muscle...right?

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