Friend pulled a gun yesterday

[GunLawyer001]

Nope. Not justified IMO. Your 'friend' escalates the situation. Might even say he provoked the whole thing since they wee just sitting on the dock. You said police could take 20 minutes. You also said they sat in their car for 30 minutes. I am guessing you , I mean your friend, never called 911?

Should have called 911 and kept an eye on the guys without confronting them. If they approaches you, then possibly. But the way it went down no. If they had been shot I have no doubt the shooter would be in jail. For quite awhile.

No, we have not yet reached the British stage of insanity, where the law-abiding are at fault for pointing out lawless behavior.

Trespassing is trespassing, and there's a perfectly valid spot in our laws for giving notice to trespassers that they are in fact trespassing. It's in the trespassing statute.

[Her9852]

call 911 and walk away .

[Qtrborecrazy]

Your friend could have called the cops and let them fish until they arrived. This pulling a gun over fishing and trespassing? Not sure his approaching the guys and getting rushed at surprises me.

Alot of small towns up here in Wayne co. have no PD, we're at the mercy of the PSP. From my understanding, there are only a few SP on duty at any time. Private road makers them trespasser, private dock makers them trespassers, and they were probably sizing up homes for break ins. Good for your friend.

[JAKIII]

If I owned water front property with a dock and some guys wished to fish there I'd be fine with it (as long as they asked permission and I was home).

Oh... and the race/nationality of the individuals is relevant because...?

[scruff]

Alot of small towns up here in Wayne co. have no PD, we're at the mercy of the PSP. From my understanding, there are only a few SP on duty at any time. Private road makers them trespasser, private dock makers them trespassers, and they were probably sizing up homes for break ins. Good for your friend.

^^ this. What better message to send than there's someone with a gun watching the neighborhood, and he's not afraid to use it?

[Adam-12]

That's not an accurate summation of the story. The story is that the gun was pulled because a man with whom angry words were exchanged, one of three who was trespassing, began running at the homeowner. At that point it's not about fishing or trespassing, it's about reasonable self-defense, and "brandishing" a firearm requires a lower threshold than pulling the trigger.

THIS.

I just finished firearms qualification, including a judgmental shooting exercise. In one case an unarmed woman grabbed my gun as I put her in the back of my car, and I shot her. The difference between justifiable use of deadly force and murder hinges critically on what the shooter knew, believed and felt at the time, and whether a reasonable person with similar training, experience, and circumstances would have thought and done in his place.

In this case the OP doesn't tell us enough. It sounds plausible that the friend had reasonable fear of a beat-down that would result in sever bodily harm or death. So it's quite possible drawing down was justified. Everyone should notice how GL described the incident, and learn from it. When describing a force encounter, you're not swapping yarns, and nobody gives a shit whether it was sunny or birds were chirping. You are explaining why you believed you were in fear of grave bodily harm or death, and why your fear was reasonable.

LEOs (including constables) are taught about what makes force justified, and how to explain their actions afterward. Anyone who goes armed should do the same. I'd go so far as to plug GL's training sessions.

Disclaimer: I haven't taken one of Phil's classes, though I mean to one time when he's near Pittsburgh. I'm not sure whether he covers after-action reporting, but I assume and hope that he does.

[jerkin]

This site is turning into a bunch of politically correct pussies. "OOHHH you said "Puerto Rican" OMG!" "Why would you confront them and give them a chance to leave, call the police, OMG!"

Give it another year and it will be, "Why were you carrying a gun in the first place?" "Don't you know a gun in the home is 5 times as likely to be used to kill your family rather than protect them?"

[Adam-12]

...and they were probably sizing up homes for break ins. Good for your friend.

Possible. Although would we think the same if they were white kids? Being Hispanic doesn't make them NOT criminals, but it doesn't make them criminals either. If the OP's friend had shot one, it might be justified, but his life would be over as he knew it. He'd have his own Trayvon Martin case: "Homeowner shoots teen for fishing while Puerto Rican."

I have NOT seen any noticeable racism on this thread, so I'm NOT talking to anyone in particular, but it's good to remember that not being a racist asshole is another asset to have if you ever find yourself defending your actions in court. Zim had a history of NOT being racist, and although it didn't help him in the press--who "promoted" him from Hispanic to white to load the dice against him--it probably helped him in court.

[Grey Bearded One]

It's called a descriptor. It allows people to paint a mental picture and envision the story how it happened as realistically as possible since they weren't there.

I'm with DGO, unless Puerto Ricans are known for fishing off docks illegally, it is only there to inflame.

However, I am upset that a twenty-four year old man doesn't know the difference between "there" and "their."

If I tell you to get off my property and you run at me while shouting, you may get shot.

[ungawa]

Possible. Although would we think the same if they were white kids?

Hell yeah. My buddy has been robbed/attempted robbed at his house and cars about 10 times. All of them white kids. I've seen video of the little bastards. They do the same shit as these guys. They all have a cover. Looking for a dog, cutting through the neighborhood to go to 7-11, you name it. The video shows different.